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#336072 - 06/05/08 04:21 PM
Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Internet Tough Guy
Registered: 07/14/06
Posts: 775
Loc: Hollywood, CA
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Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
--Tampa Tribune
TAMPA - After much deliberation by the jury, adult movie producer Max Hardcore, whose real name is Paul Little, was found guilty of 10 federal counts of distributing obscene materials over the Internet and through the mail.
His company, Maxworld Entertainment, was also found guilty on 10 related charges.
Earlier today, jurors told the judge they were having trouble reaching a verdict on half of the charges.
Jurors this afternoon sent a note to the judge reading, "If we make a decision on 10 of the 20 counts, but are unable to reach a decision on the other 10, will the 10 counts that were decided on stand?"
The judge sent a note back saying yes. The jurors responded with another note, reading, "There are people on both sides of the issues and we do not believe we will be able to make a decision on the 20 counts. How long must we deliberate? We are fairly certain we will not be able to reach a decision. This applies to 10 of the 20 counts."
U.S. District Judge Susan Bucklew assembled attorneys, brought the jury into the courtroom and gave the jury an instruction directing them to try again.
"It is your duty to agree upon a verdict on all counts if you can do so," the judge said. "I am not going to give you a length of time that you must deliberate. That's really up to you. But I am going to ask you to try again."
At this point, the jury foreman asked the judge if the jurors could take a break.
"Emotions were very high," he said. "It would be great if we could take a break now."
The judge allowed the jurors to take a break before resuming their deliberations
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#336073 - 06/05/08 04:23 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Internet Tough Guy
Registered: 07/14/06
Posts: 775
Loc: Hollywood, CA
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AVN
Max Hardcore Found Guilty in Obscenity Trial
Jurors find Max and his company guilty on all counts
By: David Sullivan
Posted: 06/05/2008
TAMPA - Producer Max Hardcore (a.k.a. Paul Little) was found guilty of 10 federal counts of distributing obscene materials over the Internet and through the mail.
Little's company Maxworld Entertainment was also found guilty on 10 related charges.
Earlier today, jurors asked U.S. District Judge Susan Bucklew for guidance today as the jury was having trouble reaching a unanimous decision.
ADVERTISEMENT
According to a report in the St. Petersburg Times, the jury foreman sent a note to Bucklew just after 3 p.m., asking: "If we make a decision on 10 of the 20 counts, but are unable to reach a decision on the other 10, will the 10 counts that we decide on stand?''
Bucklew said the jury's decision would count.
The jurors responded in another note: "There are people on both sides of the issues, and we do not believe we'll be able to reach a unanimous decision. How long must we deliberate?''
The judge urged jurors to try again.
"I'm not going to tell you how much time to deliberate, but I am going to ask you to deliberate again,'' she said.
According to the report, the jury then asked Judge Bucklew for permission to take a break, because "emotions were running very high."
Bucklew granted the break, asking attorneys to stay in the courthouse to give the jurors time to talk again. The jury returned its verdict at approximately 7 p.m.
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#336074 - 06/05/08 04:27 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Chronic Masturbator
Registered: 07/30/06
Posts: 1712
Loc: at the end of the longest line
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proof that the first amendment is dead.
_________________________
Twitter.com/degraderzim
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#336076 - 06/05/08 04:29 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Internet Tough Guy
Registered: 07/14/06
Posts: 775
Loc: Hollywood, CA
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Quote:
proof that the first amendment is dead.
Agreed, but I really expected this to be the case, the real war will be fought in the appeals.
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#336078 - 06/05/08 04:43 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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I can think of a few reasons for reversal and remand just on procedural grounds. If the Eleventh Circuit agrees, they won't consider the constitutionality* of the case and simply send it back down for a new trial. At that point, the new DOJ is unlikely to proceed, whether Obama or McCain wins in November.
*Drink 
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#336079 - 06/05/08 04:52 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Bukkake Boy
Registered: 01/29/08
Posts: 604
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Who started out posting the real name of Max Hardcore anyway?
And why would, if some publications do not mind doing this, it be posted here?
Or the name is altered already.
Whatever.
_________________________
The moderators of this heap are meaningless cunts.
The regulars of this heap are retarded cocksuckers.
Fuck this shit.
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#336080 - 06/05/08 05:14 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Porn Fucking Master
Registered: 05/18/06
Posts: 3555
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^^says the bitch who posts private messages without permission of the second party.
_________________________
"I'm going to spend the rest of the weekend deep frying the fuck out of anything that gets in my way."
--Handful
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#336082 - 06/05/08 05:29 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Internet Tough Guy
Registered: 07/14/06
Posts: 775
Loc: Hollywood, CA
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Well, the house is safe lol
Producer Max Hardcore was found guilty today of 10 federal counts of distributing obscene materials over the Internet and through the mail. His company Max World Entertainment was also found guilty on 10 related charges.
"It's a sad day for all Americans when they smash any kind of free speech and that's what happened in Tampa today," Max Hardcore told AVN. "They trampled on free speech, and I intend to appeal."
The government had separately sought the forfeiture of Hardcore's home in Altadena, Calif., but the jury ruled against that sanction.
"I'm full of good spirits and they didn't get my house," Hardcore said. "We're talking to a couple of jurors and they felt very strongly for me, but the way the laws are formulated, they were boxed in to a corner. I should have got off for this nonsense; obscenity is an archaic term, it's not defined well. I received no warning and they attempted to put me behind bars; they've got a conviction, but we intend to fight on."
Earlier today, jurors asked U.S. District Judge Susan Bucklew for guidance as the jury was having trouble reaching a unanimous decision.
The jury foreman sent a note to Bucklew just after 3 p.m., asking: "If we make a decision on 10 of the 20 counts, but are unable to reach a decision on the other 10, will the 10 counts that we decide on stand?''
Bucklew said the jury's decision would count.
The jurors responded in another note: "There are people on both sides of the issues, and we do not believe we'll be able to reach a unanimous decision. How long must we deliberate?''
The judge urged jurors to try again. "I'm not going to tell you how much time to deliberate, but I am going to ask you to deliberate again,'' she said.
The jury then asked Judge Bucklew for permission to take a break, because "emotions were running very high." Bucklew granted the break, asking attorneys to stay in the courthouse to give the jurors time to talk again.
The jury returned its verdict at approximately 7 p.m after deliberating for a total of 14 hours in the past two days.
"It was a travesty but we had no choice because of the way the law is written," one jurors told AVN.
Several jurors approached Max Hardcore and his attorneys to express their sympathy at having been forced to convict him on the counts due to the "poorly written" law regarding the transportation of obscene material via the internet and the mailing of the DVDs to the middle district of Florida.
Another juror reportedly said that if two words in the law had been different, he would have held out for acquittal.
Attorney Jeffrey Douglas echoed Max's sentiments.
"As I said in closing argument, I believe that this prosecution was shameful," Douglas told AVN. "And as Max Hardcore said, this is a sad day for America. It's a deeply sad day for him personally, but also for all of us."
Max Hardcore will be sentenced September 5. He is free on bail until that date.
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#336084 - 06/05/08 05:37 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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I don't think the kids are banned, just the scarves. If they want to stay home, it's up to them.
Turkey's a weird country, anyway. Until the end of World War I, the Ottoman Sultans were also the Caliphs and the guardians of Islam. When Ataturk founded the modern Turkish state in the 1920s, he insisted that it be secular. the Army (which he led) and the courts have stepped in several times to keep it that way.
I personally think that trying to suppress religion is counterproductive, but it is nice to have one country in that part of the world that isn't trying to wage jihad.
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#336089 - 06/05/08 07:52 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Quote:
If I can ever find Potter Stewart's grave, I'm going to go piss on it.
Here ya go.
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#336090 - 06/05/08 08:58 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Gay For Pay
Registered: 03/07/06
Posts: 1059
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Wait a second. Are you telling me that a jury decided that girls puking on each other, while covered in piss, dressed up like school girls and pretending to 14 while being slapped and fucked in the ass is obscene?
Those square bastards!!
I'm not a fan of censorship and don't want to see my porn taken away. But I saw this coming a long time ago. I just hope it doesn't lead to them going after the more generic stuff.
The only thing I can see a Obama administration going after in porn is the violence. I'm actually cool with banning scat and vomit porn. But I realize I'm probably in the minority here.
_________________________
Honestly, I don't know...I'm torn. We haven't talked since AVN (other than the hearing in February)- Eric on Bree Olson
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#336091 - 06/06/08 03:19 AM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 12/28/07
Posts: 4856
Loc: The 4th International
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CareLess 'thinks': Quote:
My moral superiority is impeccable.
That, what does not exist, cannot be impeccable.
_________________________
The only thing you got that I want, is your suffering.
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#336092 - 06/06/08 04:24 AM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Chronic Masturbator
Registered: 07/30/06
Posts: 1712
Loc: at the end of the longest line
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If vomiting and other body fluids and products shown in movies is considered obscene, let's put the guys who made Jackass 2 on trial. The "fart helmet" scene in particular.
Why are things viewed as much more sickening and outrageous just because sexual penetration is involved also?
I don't get it.
_________________________
Twitter.com/degraderzim
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#336093 - 06/06/08 05:08 AM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Stormy's Lawyer
Registered: 11/24/03
Posts: 29
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Quote:
"It was a travesty but we had no choice because of the way the law is written," one jurors told AVN.
Several jurors approached Max Hardcore and his attorneys to express their sympathy at having been forced to convict him on the counts due to the "poorly written" law regarding the transportation of obscene material via the internet and the mailing of the DVDs to the middle district of Florida.
THAT'S COMPLETE NONSENSE!
The jurors did what they did because they were (and are) uninformed about their rights as jurors (Max Hardcore, himself, is utterly ignorant about juror rights, as well):
Fact # 1: When you are a jury member at a courtroom trial, you ARE the law. While deliberating and deciding which way to vote (Guilty or Not Guilty), you are perfectly free and within your rights as a juror to totally disregard any law, statute, or regulation for any reason whatsoever, nor do you have to explain or justify your decision to ANYONE.
Fact # 2: When you are a jury member at a courtroom trial, you ARE NOT OBLIGATED to follow a judge's instructions (or anyone else's, for that matter).
Max Hardcore's jury convicted him because they were totally unaware of the two FACTS stated above.
The reason that this is a sad day for Americans is not because Max was convicted and not because the First Amendment to the Constitution was trampled upon, but BECAUSE THE AVERAGE AMERICAN CITIZEN HAS NO CLUE WHAT HIS/HER CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS ARE. And the reason that they don't know is BECAUSE THEY WON'T READ IT and THE GOVERNMENT WON'T TELL THEM! But then, very few people in government have read the constitution, either.
I freely admit that I was as clueless as the next person about these matters until one day I received a little pamphlet entitled "Citizens Rule Book/Jury Handbook" by Alex Jones
Before I proceed, I would like for you to copy (or copy, paste, and print) this message from this sentence on down and pass it on to everyone you know and ask them to repeat the process.
Below are some quotes from "Citizens Rule Book/Jury Handbook" (by Alex Jones):
"The base of power was to remain in WE THE PEOPLE but unfortunately, it was lost to those leaders acting in the name of government, such as politicians, bureaucrats, judges, lawyers, etc.
"As a result America began to function like a democracy instead of a REPUBLIC. A democracy is dangerous because it is a one-vote system as opposed to a Republic, which is a three-vote system. Three votes to check tyranny, not just one. American citizens have not been informed of their other two votes.
"Our first vote is at the polls on election day when we pick those who are to represent us in the seats of government. But what can be done if those elected officials just don't perform as promised or expected? Well, the second two votes are the most effective means by which the common people of any nation on earth have ever had in controlling those appointed to serve them in government.
"The second vote comes when you serve on a Grand Jury. Before anyone can be brought to trial for a capital or infamous crime by those acting in the name of government, permission must be obtained from people serving on the Grand Jury! The Minneapolis Star and Tribune in March 27, 1987, edition noted a purpose of the Grand Jury this way: 'A grand jury's purpose is to protect the public from an overzealous prosecutor.'
"The third is the most powerful vote: this is when you are acting as a jury member during a courtroom trial. At this point, 'the buck stops' with you! It is in this setting that each JUROR has MORE POWER than the President, all of Congress, and all of the judges combined! Congress can legislate (make law), the President or some other bureaucrat can make an order or issue regulations, and judges can instruct or make a decision, but no JUROR can ever be punished for voting 'Not Guilty!' Any Juror can, with impunity, choose to disregard the instructions of any judge or attorney in rendering his vote. If only one JUROR should vote "Not Guilty" for any reason, there is no conviction and no punishment at the end of the trial. Thus, those acting in the name of government must come before the common man to get permission to enforce the law.
"As a JUROR in a trial setting, when it comes to your individual vote of innocent or guilty, you truly are answerable only to GOD ALMIGHTY. The First Amendment to the Constitution was born out of this great concept. However, judges of today refuse to inform JURORS of their RIGHTS."
The pamphlet goes on to state that jurors are actually ABOVE the law (while acting in the capacity of a jury member during a courtroom trial). It also mentions some very important quotes in a section entitled JURY RIGHTS:
JURY RIGHTS
"'The jury has a right to judge both the law as well as the fact in controversy.' John Jay, 1st Chief Justice, U.S. Supreme Court, 1789
'The jury has the right to determine both the law and the facts.' Samuel Chase, U.S. Supreme Court Justice, 1796, Signer of The Unanimous Declaration.
'The jury has the power to bring a verdict in the teeth of both law and fact.' Oliver Wendell Holmes, U.S. Supreme Court Justice, 1902
'The law itself is on trial quite as much as the cause which is to be decided.' Harlan F. Stone, 12th Chief Justice, U.S. Supreme Court, 1941
'The pages of history shine on instances of the jury's exercise of its prerogative to disregard instructions of the judge...' U.S. vs. Dougherty, 473 F 2nd 1113, 1139, (1972)"
And one last thing. In a section entitled "Law of the Land," the aforementioned pamphlet states the following:
"The general misconception is that any statute passed by legislators bearing the appearance of law constitutes the law of the land. The U.S. Constitution is the supreme law of the land, and any statute, to be valid, must be in agreement. It is impossible for a law which violates the Constitution to be valid. This is succinctly stated as follows:
'All laws which are repugnant to the Constitution are null and void.' Marbury vs. Madison, 5 US (2 Cranch) 137, 174, 176, (1803)
'Where rights secured by the Constitution are involved, there can be no rule making or legislation which would abrogate them.' Miranda vs. Arizona, 384 US 436 p. 491."
As should be painfully aware to all of us by now, the Federal government is becoming increasingly tyrannical. But if each U.S. citizen were fully aware of all three of their votes, we could collectively go a long way in balancing the power between government and We the People.
The following previous quote bears repeating (and with emphasis):
"The third is the most powerful vote: this is when you are acting as a jury member during a courtroom trial. At this point, 'the buck stops' with you! It is in this setting that each JUROR has MORE POWER than the President, all of Congress, and all of the judges combined!"
KNOWLEDGE IS POWER!
Pass this information on in as many ways as you can think of. Make copies and distribute it to everyone you know and ask them to do the same. Post this information on as many websites as you can. Write to editors of newspapers and magazines and try to get them to publish this information in their editorial section. Blog this information if you are a blogger. Send this information out via your e-mail contacts list. Do your part to get this information out to as many people as possible, as fast as possible.
Most important of all: Read the Constitution to become fully aware of your rights as a U.S. citizen! (The Constitution is available free online--just Google it.)
PASS THIS INFORMATION ON FAR AND WIDE!
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#336094 - 06/06/08 05:57 AM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Whoremaster
Registered: 10/21/05
Posts: 2710
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Quote:
If vomiting and other body fluids and products shown in movies is considered obscene, let's put the guys who made Jackass 2 on trial. The "fart helmet" scene in particular.
Why are things viewed as much more sickening and outrageous just because sexual penetration is involved also?
I don't get it.
You think that's bad? In one of the CKY flicks (one of the precursors to Jackass), Bam and friends think it will be fun to smear fecal matter on their pal's face while he sleeps.
This movie is legally available in the UK, BBFC certified and everything... 
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#336095 - 06/06/08 06:18 AM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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AC Cream Wannabe
Registered: 05/23/06
Posts: 486
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man where are you guys gonna get your fantasized pedophilia videos now?
_________________________
throatfucking is family entertainment
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#336098 - 06/06/08 07:57 AM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Will Max Case Be The One to Go to The US Supreme Court?---Tampa Tribune via Gene Ross TAMPA - Over several hours last week and this, seven men and five women on a federal jury have watched some of the most extreme pornography commercially available today. Some lawyers and academics wonder why. Critics of obscenity cases question the federal government's decision to file these charges, especially considering the defining case law is 35 years old and was on shaky legal ground to begin with. Federal obscenity law requires jurors to determine whether the material is patently offensive to the average person based on community standards. In the age of the Internet, however, a community's standards have become more difficult, if not impossible, to define. Still, as vocally as some question the government's role in deciding what is obscene, others are egging on federal prosecutors to stop the progression of the pornography industry as it becomes increasingly bizarre. "There's been no real prosecution regarding adult obscenity and it's gotten totally out of hand," said David Caton, executive director of the Tampa-based Florida Family Association. "Where in society do we say enough is enough?" The videos that jurors watched in Tampa, produced by and starring California resident Paul Little, feature scenes of violence and humiliation, urination and vomiting. Little, who goes by the name Max Hardcore, was convicted Thursday on five charges of distributing obscene material over the Internet and five counts of distributing obscene material through the U.S. mail. As the attorneys prepare an inevitable appeal, some experts wonder whether this will become the case that prompts the U.S. Supreme Court to revisit the country's obscenity laws. Miller V. CaliforniaIn 1973, the U.S. Supreme Court issued a controversial opinion in the case Miller v. California. The opinion developed a test to determine whether material is obscene. In part, it asks a jury to decide if the average person applying contemporary community standards would find that the material is intended to sexually arouse in a patently offensive way. Eric M. Freedman, a constitutional law professor at Hofstra University in New York, said that concept is constitutionally flawed. The First Amendment, Freedman said, is intended to protect unpopular speech from those who would gather together to quash it. The Miller decision, Freedman said, skirts the First Amendment. It allows a community to determine what can be expressed by minority groups within that community. The problem in modern times, Freedman said, is that there are no average people who can apply the standards of their community. "The idea of local standards, which was deeply problematic when it originated, has now become thoroughly obsolete in the Internet age," Freedman said. The current Supreme Court has avoided making judgments on the Miller decision but, with cases such as Little's, it might not be able to dodge the question much longer. Assuming Little's attorneys have laid the foundation for a constitutional appeal, this case could head to the Supreme Court someday and result in a new challenge to the validity of local community standards and obscenity, Freedman said. Still, several factors could stand in the way. "I wouldn't overestimate the chances," Freedman said. "Even if the issue is there, the Supreme Court may not take it. Those reasons could be tactical or political." Clearwater lawyer Luke Lirot, who acknowledges that he is as much an advocate of the First Amendment as an expert on its intricacies, said he does not like Little's videos. Lirot's client base has included strippers, pornographers and prostitutes. Still, he said, his tastes are significantly more "vanilla" than the Max Hardcore titles. He doesn't think he's alone. Most of the people in America would not enjoy Little's videos, Lirot said - but the material is not meant for them. Its intended audience is a small minority of people who enjoy watching consenting adults take sexual acts to an extreme. The concept is not unlike television reality shows where people eat worms and sit in vats of insects, Lirot said. "It's like 'Fear Factor,' people watching what extremes people will subject themselves to," Lirot said. The acts performed in Little's videos are not illegal, Lirot said, but because they are sexual, the government says it is illegal to film and distribute them. Acts Become More ExtremeCaton said some First Amendment advocates miss the point of the Miller decision. The Miller case determined that obscenity is not protected speech. That is why the justices in 1973 developed the test. The Internet, Caton said, is just another pipeline. "The only difference is that the images are coming from a telephone wire or cable, not the mailbox," he said. As in all obscenity cases, material is produced in one place and shipped to another. It doesn't matter whether it's a magazine, a video or a digital clip: If it's obscene, it is not legal, Caton said. When the government does not prosecute obscenity charges, pornography becomes more extreme, Caton said. During the Clinton administration, he said, over-the-counter magazines such as Penthouse and Hustler went from soft-core to hard-core. Popular stores that cater to the public are selling magazines that include urination scenes, Caton said. "There is a certain level of degradation that goes beyond erotic art and erotic entertainment," he said. "I don't think it's any coincidence that we are seeing women abducted from universities. They have been degraded to the point of being toys." Caton said it is encouraging that a jury in an area such as Tampa, where adult businesses flourish, found that there is a point where sexual exploitation is not tolerated. Over the past seven years, Caton said, the family association has lobbied the U.S. Department of Justice to take a more active role in the prosecution of obscenity. In a 2007 Senate committee meeting, then-Attorney General Alberto Gonzales said his office asked for the resignation of a Nevada U.S. attorney in part because of the attorney's lackluster desire to prosecute obscenity, according to a transcript of the meeting published in The Washington Post. The choice to investigate and to prosecute obscenity cases lies with the presidential administration, said law professor Freedman. If President Bush wants federal prosecutors to focus on obscenity laws, that is his right as an elected leader. In the case of obscenity, however, the endeavor is quixotic, Freedman said. When federal prosecutors push these cases, they might ultimately force the U.S. Supreme Court to revisit the Miller decision. Freedman acknowledged, however, that the Internet obscenity issue recently came before the U.S. Supreme Court and the justices managed to sidestep the Miller issue. In 2002, the court was asked to review a lower court's ruling on the proposed Childhood Online Protection Act. The lower court had questioned the Miller test's applications to the Internet. Under the Miller test, the judges determined, no one could post anything to the Internet unless it meets the standards of the most puritanical community in America. The Supreme Court avoided the community standards question altogether. "The Supreme Court is well aware that the idea of local standards is under severe pressure in the Internet age but has so far managed to avoid it squarely," Freedman said. + + + I don't think the Supremes are going anywhere near this case, but anything's possible.
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#336099 - 06/06/08 07:59 AM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Max Hardcore Prison Bitch
Registered: 04/02/05
Posts: 314
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Does this mean Max's circulated videos will now go up in value? I have a piece of shit Maxworld VHS from the 1990s that I use as a doorstop and haven't watched since I mistakenly purchased it. But now that Max is a major bad-ass criminal, his nasty contraband may actually be worth something to me. [Brushes dust and cat's piss off Maxworld Video Magazine No. 6 - "Oh, a young Maria Bellucci! I may have to take another look at that movie after all"] 
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#336100 - 06/06/08 08:14 AM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Gag Factor Guru
Porn Jesus
Registered: 07/15/05
Posts: 5290
Loc: Dayton
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I might as well do my rant here.
The disturbing thing to me is the idea that something is considered obscene because it is out of the mainstream. We hear that term a lot now, out of the mainstream. Now, mainstream pornography is alright. But Max pushed the edge, he is different in a way that does not appeal to the mainstream. Conform. Surrender. Do as you are told. Follow the herd.
FUCK THAT
My car has a stick shift and a turbocharger. It had a Kucinich bumper sticker for a while. I've never seen American Idol, haven't been in a McDonald's short order restaurant for over 10 years, and have no interest in NASCAR. I'm vegetarian. I pray twice a day, but never go to church. I shave my balls. I am proficient at Morse Code. I have been sober for 17 years, but advocate the legalization of recreational drugs. I'm going to quit chasing money, retire at 55, and live out of my motorhome. I drink the juice straight out of the olive jar, so come get me, mutherfuckers!
If one more sick, left side of the bell curve asshole tries to tell me about his house in the suburbs and his two soccer playing boys named Wally and Beaver, I just might do something out of the mainstream.
Every advancement made by mankind was because someone thought outside the mainstream. Thank God for the Max Hardcores in engineering and science, philosophy, medicine, and the arts. I refuse to attempt to conform to "community standards". And so far, my life has been a lot more interesting than anything I've ever heard from the Ward Cleavers of the world.
Give me liberty, or give me death. Bless you, Max, I have the highest respect for you for keeping up the fight.
-Chuck, Vegetarian fanboy
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#336102 - 06/06/08 08:43 AM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Porn Fucking Master
Registered: 10/30/06
Posts: 3812
Loc: Neither here, nor there.
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Quote:
I might as well do my rant here.
The disturbing thing to me is the idea that something is considered obscene because it is out of the mainstream. We hear that term a lot now, out of the mainstream. Now, mainstream pornography is alright. But Max pushed the edge, he is different in a way that does not appeal to the mainstream. Conform. Surrender. Do as you are told. Follow the herd.
FUCK THAT
My car has a stick shift and a turbocharger. It had a Kucinich bumper sticker for a while. I've never seen American Idol, haven't been in a McDonald's short order restaurant for over 10 years, and have no interest in NASCAR. I'm vegetarian. I pray twice a day, but never go to church. I shave my balls. I am proficient at Morse Code. I have been sober for 17 years, but advocate the legalization of recreational drugs. I'm going to quit chasing money, retire at 55, and live out of my motorhome. I drink the juice straight out of the olive jar, so come get me, mutherfuckers!
If one more sick, left side of the bell curve asshole tries to tell me about his house in the suburbs and his two soccer playing boys named Wally and Beaver, I just might do something out of the mainstream.
Every advancement made by mankind was because someone thought outside the mainstream. Thank God for the Max Hardcores in engineering and science, philosophy, medicine, and the arts. I refuse to attempt to conform to "community standards". And so far, my life has been a lot more interesting than anything I've ever heard from the Ward Cleavers of the world.
Give me liberty, or give me death. Bless you, Max, I have the highest respect for you for keeping up the fight.
-Chuck, Vegetarian fanboy
_________________________
"You know this is XXXPornTalk.com right? You sound like an ADT person. I want to poop on you." -Malice
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#336103 - 06/06/08 09:35 AM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Porn Fucking Master
Registered: 05/18/06
Posts: 3555
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rock on, charin. and praise jesus to all men who shave their balls. hallelujah.
_________________________
"I'm going to spend the rest of the weekend deep frying the fuck out of anything that gets in my way."
--Handful
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#336105 - 06/06/08 09:53 AM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 09/18/05
Posts: 138
Loc: Nunyo Biznass
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Another good article. SOURCE Jurors convict adult film producer By Kevin Graham, Times Staff Writer TAMPA — Twelve federal jurors drew the line Thursday for Tampa Bay area residents, saying the graphic and violent films of a Hollywood pornographer are unacceptable in their community. They reached that decision after watching 81/2 hours of extreme pornography on a giant screen in court. At times, they winced as an adult film producer who calls himself Max Hardcore performed in scenes that included urinating, vomiting and violently dominating women. After nearly two weeks of trial and roughly 12 hours of deliberation, jurors decided what they had seen went beyond the Tampa Bay region's community standards. They convicted the actor and producer, whose real name is Paul F. Little, 51, of Altadena, Calif., and his company, MaxWorld Entertainment Inc., of 10 counts of selling obscene material on the Internet and 10 counts of shipping it to Tampa through the U.S. mail. Jurors asked that their names not be used. But several spoke of how emotional it had been and how tensions among them escalated Thursday as they deliberated, temporarily unable to reach a decision on half of the charges. "We made the right decision," a male juror said. Among their ranks were an accounts receivable clerk with three young children at home, a licensed practical nurse, an insurance claims adjuster, a civil engineer. A pawnshop owner served as the jury foreman. They said they plan to write a book about their jury service. And they criticized the law that was the basis for charges of aiding in the use of the U.S. mail to send the films to Tampa. The president of Jaded Video, a California adult film distributor, testified that his business sold Little's films from Jaded's Web site and selected the U.S. mail to deliver them to customers. Little's attorneys argued that he had no knowledge or control over that process. The judge, citing the law, told jurors that someone can be guilty of causing the mail to be used if, in the ordinary course of business, they perform an act where the use of the mail can reasonably be foreseen. In this case, Little sold his films to a business that would distribute them. As they heard the word "guilty" read 20 times inside the courtroom, Little and his team of attorneys, including two former presidents of the First Amendment Lawyers Association, bowed their heads and remained motionless. "We believe in freedom of speech, and this is a setback," MaxWorld attorney Louis Sirkin said afterward, vowing to appeal. "We expect to get our day of reckoning. It's not over." At his attorneys' request, Little didn't comment on the verdicts. But earlier, he spoke at liberty to a St. Petersburg Times reporter about his views. "People down here should be outraged that the government is saying you can't watch two people f---," Little said. "If this is bad, where is the outrage here? Where's the protesters?" Prosecutors charged Little and MaxWorld each with five counts of using a computer server to sell and distribute obscene material and each with five counts of distributing obscene matter through the U.S. mail. He faces a maximum of five years in prison for each conviction when he is sentenced Sept. 5 by presiding U.S. District Judge Susan C. Bucklew. Little and MaxWorld face separate fines of up to $250,000. Jurors spared Little from having to forfeit his house to the government, but decided as part of their verdict that he turn over three adult-oriented Web sites that advertise or sell his MaxWorld films. The otherwise stoic defendant wiped tears from his eyes when he learned they had decided not to take his home. Just hours into their deliberations on Wednesday, jurors sought to clarify the meanings of several words and phrases in their jury instructions, including "morbid and degraded," "unhealthy interest in sex," and "candid interest in sex." The judge refused their request to use a dictionary, and said they should rely on their common sense. The case drew the attention of an adult film industry critic, who flew from California to write about it. Interns studying law sat in the courtroom to hear the legal arguments. And local First Amendment attorney Luke Lirot, who occasionally defends strip club operators locally, sat in the courtroom on several occasions. Attorneys with the Justice Department's Child Exploitation and Obscenity Section prosecuted the case in Tampa because Little's Max Hardcore site was housed on computer servers downtown for at least three years. Defense attorneys said Little never knew his site was housed in Tampa, and that prosecutors never produced any evidence that he did. In closing arguments, the defense called on jurors to consider the nearly five-dozen adult oriented businesses in the bay area and infer what that suggested about the local community standards. Justice Department attorney Edward McAndrew urged jurors to rely on how the films made them feel as they watched. He told them in closing arguments that had the law not required they stay, he wouldn't blame them for running for the exits. "These videos aren't only offensive, they assault your senses," McAndrew said.
_________________________
"If it has tits or wheels, it's gonna give you problems."
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#336110 - 06/06/08 10:48 AM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Stormy's Lawyer
Registered: 11/24/03
Posts: 29
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Here are six questions for everyone who has posted (or who will post) in this thread (hint, you don't need to be a lawyer to answer any of these questions, just use common sense):
Q1: If you had been one of the jurors at Max Hardcore's trial and you decided to vote "Not Guilty" on each and every charge, could any of the other jurors FORCE you to change your vote to "Guilty" on any of the charges?
Q2: If you remained steadfast in your position, and no matter how long jury deliberations dragged on, could the judge fine or imprison you or in any other way punish you?
Q3: Are you under any legal obligation to reach a consensus of opinion with the other jurors?
Q4: Do you bear any legal obligation to follow the judge's instructions on how to apply the law?
Q5: If, as one of the jurors at Max Hardcore's trial, you voted "Not Guilty" on each and every charge, what would have been the outcome of that trial?
Q6: What is the supreme law of the land?
If you are unsure of the answers to any of the above questions, please read my first post in this thread in its entirety.
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#336111 - 06/06/08 11:01 AM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Quote:
Vote for Obama and the justice department will leave porn alone.
I seriously doubt a McCain DOJ would waste taxpayers money on this nonsense, either. Even with Rudy in charge. Again, his faux pornophobia never surfaced until he saw the economic advantages of Disnification.
Besides, if I know Rudy, he'd spend most of his time finding new ways to conduct wiretaps and push the limits of the Patriot Act. 
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#336113 - 06/06/08 11:05 AM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Porn Fucking Master
Registered: 10/30/06
Posts: 3812
Loc: Neither here, nor there.
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In a truly free society, none of this should matter. He has his 2257 records, he pays his taxes, and he committed no crime against anyone. The religious right scores again.
_________________________
"You know this is XXXPornTalk.com right? You sound like an ADT person. I want to poop on you." -Malice
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#336118 - 06/06/08 11:32 AM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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1735.
A modern-day example of Jury Nullification (arguably, at least) is the OJ trial. I seem to recall that some jurors actually stated after the verdict that there was no way, no how they were going to convict him.
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#336123 - 06/06/08 11:58 AM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Quote:
That case was RUINED by inept prosecution
Oh, without a doubt, much like the Schlieffen plan was ruined by an inept general. Still, I remember hearing it way back when. I suppose it could be apocryphal.
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#336125 - 06/06/08 12:10 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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The whole thing is just so retarded to me. We're the only legal industry who has to deal with this kind of bullshit from our own government. Unreal. 
Every single industry has to put up with bullshit from the gov. The FACT is, like it or not, there are laws on the books regarding obscenity, and like it or not, Max's product is in violation of those laws, as evidenced by the guilty verdicts.
The porn buissnes for years has flouted many many laws(unliscend agents,illegal workers form other countries,cash payments{dodging taxes},not to mention complete disregard for any health and safety laws,no workers comp insurance.
It is time for the ADULT industry to grow up and do something other that whine and complain about how persecuted they are. If you want to disregard the law and play with fire then dont complain when you get burned.
Should there be laws against obscene material, I dont know. But the fact is there are laws, and Max's material is in violation of those laws. If you dont like it, then do something about it.
And regarding the post that seems to justify jury nullification, that is a very dangerous, and slippery slope my friend. Juror independence can be much more dangerous to an innocent person, than helpful to someone who is guily but hoping the jury will "let him off" because they dont like the law. Some would say this is what the Max jury did. They ignored that Jaded sent the videos and convicted Max anyway. Be careful what you ask for, you might just get it.
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#336127 - 06/06/08 12:21 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Porn Fucking Master
Registered: 10/30/06
Posts: 3812
Loc: Neither here, nor there.
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Quote:
Quote:
The whole thing is just so retarded to me. We're the only legal industry who has to deal with this kind of bullshit from our own government. Unreal.
Every single industry has to put up with bullshit from the gov. The FACT is, like it or not, there are laws on the books regarding obscenity, and like it or not, Max's product is in violation of those laws, as evidenced by the guilty verdicts.
The porn buissnes for years has flouted many many laws(unliscend agents,illegal workers form other countries,cash payments{dodging taxes},not to mention complete disregard for any health and safety laws,no workers comp insurance.
It is time for the ADULT industry to grow up and do something other that whine and complain about how persecuted they are. If you want to disregard the law and play with fire then dont complain when you get burned.
Should there be laws against obscene material, I dont know. But the fact is there are laws, and Max's material is in violation of those laws. If you dont like it, then do something about it.
And regarding the post that seems to justify jury nullification, that is a very dangerous, and slippery slope my friend. Juror independence can be much more dangerous to an innocent person, than helpful to someone who is guily but hoping the jury will "let him off" because they dont like the law. Some would say this is what the Max jury did. They ignored that Jaded sent the videos and convicted Max anyway. Be careful what you ask for, you might just get it.
In every mainstream business the laws are defined, and they're not in porn. DVDs are illegal if they're found to be "obscene by community standards"...
Well, what's the definition of "obscene"? Is it fisting? peeing? anal? fake tits? degradation? popshots? What is it exactly so that producers can prevent being arbitrarily arrested?
How about "community"? Could this mean a neighborhood, kind of like a housing plan? A small town? city? state? How about the entire country?
The rules are only defined when they want to prosecute someone and that's not cool in ANY country, let alone one that's supposed to be the "Land of the free".
_________________________
"You know this is XXXPornTalk.com right? You sound like an ADT person. I want to poop on you." -Malice
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#336130 - 06/06/08 12:38 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Quote:
That's what the appeal process is for.
Again, it may not even be determined at that point. Appellate courts love, love, LOVE to duck complex issues when a case can be decided upon more settled ones.
Here, I would not be surprised if the case gets remanded for a new trial based, among other things, upon whether the Judge's decision to allow the Government to play excerpts of the charged titles violated Max's right to Due Process, the argument being that the ruling improperly shifted the burden of proof to defendants. The fact that defendants were allowed to show the jury the remainder of the material is irrelevant; they should never have been placed in that position. The burden was on the Government to prove that the charged material, taken as a whole, violates community standards and the excerpts ruling put it upon the defense.
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#336131 - 06/06/08 12:40 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 04/14/06
Posts: 14755
Loc: Busy downloading [LEGALLY!]
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Quote:
The porn buissnes for years has flouted many many laws(unliscend agents,illegal workers form other countries,cash payments{dodging taxes},not to mention complete disregard for any health and safety laws,no workers comp insurance.
My issue is free speech.
So, on these points I won't support them. Who would?
Most porn producers seems to be scumbags and felons. This community loves to attack Gigi's "boyfriend" because he's a registered sex offender. Another prominent one I won't mention is a convicted felon. And, I'm still sure one who committed suicide had something to do with his newlywed's demise.
If they are in violation of employment laws, tax laws, et. al., that everyone else has to follow, they should be hammered for it.
That's not free speech. And, I won't sympathize with them.
I HATE Max's work.
If you are familiar with my porn "likes", imagine how bad it has to be for me not to like teeny bopper porn. I wouldn't notice if Max went out of business.
But, convicting Max just threatened MY free speech.
How can you know in advance that a community finds something offensive? And why should a community decide what I can and cannot watch? Where do "community standards" end?
The law is unjust. And, the verdict needs to be overturned.
_________________________
Amo i Gemelli!! 
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#336133 - 06/06/08 12:50 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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In every mainstream business the laws are defined, and they're not in porn. DVDs are illegal if they're found to be "obscene by community standards"...
Well, what's the definition of "obscene"? Is it fisting? peeing? anal? fake tits? degradation? popshots? What is it exactly so that producers can prevent being arbitrarily arrested?
How about "community"? Could this mean a neighborhood, kind of like a housing plan? A small town? city? state? How about the entire country?
The rules are only defined when they want to prosecute someone and that's not cool in ANY country, let alone one that's supposed to be the "Land of the free".
ALL pornographers, MAx included, are fully aware of the ambiguity in the laws. To define 'community standards' and "obscen" we have juries(selected by both the prosocution and DEFENSE). Is it a perfect system? NO. Its far from it. If your argument is that there should be no obscenity laws, then it is up to you and people who share your views to elect representitives who will change those laws. If your argument is that Max's material is not obscene and does not fit the MILLER TEST, then i would have to ask, If Max's material is not obscen then what is?
And nobody has ever been ARBITRARILY arrested on obscenity charges. Most obscenity charges are bought against the so called 'worst of the worst' which is the exact category that many, even in the adult industry and right here on this board, put Max in.
Put aside the Legal definition(whatever that is) of obscene,and use YOUR OWN JUDGEMENT to answer one question.
Do you think Max's material is obscene?
I think the answer to that question is an absolute yes. Now should it be illegal? Right now it is, like it or not. And for the record I dont like it. Freedom of speech is NOT absolute.(yelling fire in a crowded theatre) Where we draw the line depends on who we elect to office, and if you think DEMOCRATS will change these laws or not enforce them, then, in my opinion, you're wrong. Rememeber it was the democrats who gave us the PMRC and the movie rating system(in order to make decisions FOR YOU, and not let you make that decision yourself)
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#336134 - 06/06/08 01:05 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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Quote:
Quote:
and like it or not, Max's product is in violation of those laws, as evidenced by the guilty verdicts.
We don't know that yet. That's what the appeal process is for.
As of righ now Max is Guilty of the charges bought against him. We know that because the jury foreman read 20 guilty verdicts out loud in the courtroom. Just because he has appealed, or will appeal the VERDICTS does not change the fact that he is now GUILTY of those charges. He will be sentenced on SEPT. 5 because he is guilty. Until the appeals court says otherwise, he IS guilty.
Now what grounds will Max base his appeals? Will he defend his product as 'not being obscene', or will his appeals be based on technicalities in the law(jury uinstructions etc.)
Will he have the guts to appeal on constitutional issues, or will he go the technicality route.
An opinion for PORNLAW would be greatly appreciated here.
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#336135 - 06/06/08 01:18 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Quote:
And nobody has ever been ARBITRARILY arrested on obscenity charges.
Tell that to Lenny Bruce.
As for Max, he'll appeal on every issue his lawyers he can think of. What I was saying above is simply that, if the Eleventh Circuit finds grounds for reversal on a more settled issue (like Due Process) they need not even consider Miller.
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#336136 - 06/06/08 02:27 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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Quote:
Quote:
And nobody has ever been ARBITRARILY arrested on obscenity charges.
Tell that to Lenny Bruce.
As for Max, he'll appeal on every issue his lawyers he can think of. What I was saying above is simply that, if the Eleventh Circuit finds grounds for reversal on a more settled issue (like Due Process) they need not even consider Miller.
What i meant by nobody being arbitrarily arrested is that it is usually the ones who "poke the bear", like Rob Black and Max who get busted. There are leterally hundreds of people the feds could get on the same charges, but it is usually the 'high profile' ones who get chosen. Its not like they throw all the names in ahat and choose one unlucky bastard. Max and Rob and stagliano were chosen for reason, not arbitrarily. (imho)
And yes Lenny Bruce may disagree, but he too liked to "poke the bear".
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#336138 - 06/06/08 07:13 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Poodle Killer
Internet Tough Guy
Registered: 02/24/06
Posts: 812
Loc: Rubbing dicks with strange guy...
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Great news...!!
Couldn't of happened to a better guy,,,I can,t wait for the sentencing...I am hoping five to seven..  ]We will see how he likes getting corn-holed..
And if i was the prosecutor,I would refile the other ten charges and go after him again..
Max will now begin to die a slow death...Its a good day Laddy,,It's a good day.... 
Edited by Richard Hungwell (06/06/08 07:15 PM)
_________________________
100 Cigarettes
King Richard
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#336139 - 06/06/08 08:45 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 09/20/05
Posts: 9181
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For Richard Hungwell, who I suspect is not a U.S. citizen, and the rest of you, please recall Alexis de Tocqueville: Quote:
"...the moral authority of the majority is partly based on the notion that there is more intelligence and wisdom in a number of men united than a single individual, and that the number of legislators is more important that their quality."
Quote:
"The sovereign can no longer say, 'You shall think as I do on pain of death': but he says, 'You are free to think differently from me, and to retain your life, your property, and all that you possess; but if such be your determination, you are henceforth an alien along your people. You may retain your civil rights, buy they will be useless to you, for you will never be chosen by your fellow-citizens, if you solicit their suffrages; and they will affect to scorn you, if you solicit their esteem. You will remain among men, but you like an impure being; and those who are mostly persuaded of your innocence will abandon you too, lest they should be shunned in their turn.'"
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#336141 - 06/06/08 10:48 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 01/25/06
Posts: 4470
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Quote:
If one more sick, left side of the bell curve asshole tries to tell me about his house in the suburbs and his two soccer playing boys named Wally and Beaver, I just might do something out of the mainstream.
Every advancement made by mankind was because someone thought outside the mainstream. Thank God for the Max Hardcores in engineering and science, philosophy, medicine, and the arts. I refuse to attempt to conform to "community standards". And so far, my life has been a lot more interesting than anything I've ever heard from the Ward Cleavers of the world.
For some reason, Pleasantville comes to mind. Weird.
Quote:
We're the only legal industry who has to deal with this kind of bullshit from our own government. Unreal.
Simply because that same government & the sheeple peon fucks who inhabit it want to do away with you, Viz.
Quote:
The rules are only defined when they want to prosecute someone and that's not cool in ANY country, let alone one that's supposed to be the "Land of the free".
Like obsenity laws, that slogan is really fucking outdated. I haven't been 'free' since I've been able to drive.
_________________________
Because you already yelled 'dropping prices!!!' after Red Light canned you. - Gia Jordan to Brandon Iron
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#336142 - 06/07/08 10:14 AM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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Well, i got banned again from ADT. A few good doses of reality and they couldnt handle it. Just because I dont believe in the right wing christian conspiracy, I guess thats not acceptable over there.
Not one single juror on the Max case could even be remotely considered a right wing conservative. Just 12 average random selected people, screened and approvedby the defense and presecution.
And since I now cant respond to the free swipes theyre taking at me, I would appreciate the opportunity to respond to Tricia D. here.......she questions my AGENDA.
My agenda now, and for the last 25 years has been to make ALL sex work legal. The single biggest obstacle tomakeing this a reality is,believe it or not, the porn industry in california. Their REFUSAL to accept any kind of regulation(health safety, liscens agents,and liscensed sex workers just like in nevada) is preventing any steps forward towrds this goal.
Another thing they didnt like at ADT was my pointing out that all the yahooing about standing up for the first ammendment and when given the chance, Max sat there silent an never took the stand(perfectly within his rights),but surely not consistant with a FREE SPEECH advocates usual stance. Of course, If Max took the stand, and the prosecutor asked him about what he knew about obscenity laws, it would have sealed the conviction. For the same reasons, our next defender of free speech, j. Stagliano will probably do the same thing, (time will tell), or more likely, cop a plea.
But what really riled them on ADT was when I pointed out that you dont have to be a right wing nut to be disgusted by porn like max produces. Just wait until your ten year old daughter asks you what double anal is after she presses one wrong key on the computer looking for her pogo game site. I think people on these boards give WAY to much credit to the vast Right wing conspiracy. There was not a single juror who could be considered a RIGHT winger.
And if you think this conviction will have impact in porn valley you aint seen nothing yet. This was just a little jab, the real knockout punch is coming from Cal-Osha. I've been trying to work for over two decades now to make sex work legal by working from the side of the workers. Now I will turn to the govt for assistance as much as I regret it.
So while your busy looking over your shoulders for the next big obscentiy case, keep a little eye out for th OSHA guys. I PROMISE you will see OSHA in porn valley NEXT WEEK.
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#336143 - 06/07/08 10:51 AM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 04/14/06
Posts: 14755
Loc: Busy downloading [LEGALLY!]
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Quote:
There was not a single juror who could be considered a RIGHT winger.
There was no Christian on the jury?
No one whose kid was in a religious parochial school?
There was no creationists?
THOSE ARE ALL RIGHT WING LOONEYS!
You have NO IDEA what these people are.
Being disgusted isn't the issue you complete waste of flesh. Allowing free speech GUARANTEES you will be disgusted. If you can't tolerate being disgusted, you don't merit free speech and should shut up.
I have no problem with OSHA regulating health. I have no problem with California finding porn actors, like mainstream actors, to be employees and not "free lance" when it comes to worker's comp, etc. If providing protection for employees "ruins" the porn industry, TOUGH! Not my issue. Porn will get NO support from me.
I have a problems with people interfering with free speech on any level. We have just gone thru years of being told that if we didn't support this mental midget jeebus freak trying to get revenge for his daddy, you were called a traitor.
That scares me. And, it starts on the fringes and works its way in.
Whether that's Max gagging girls, the battle flag, the Turner Diaries, FOX News or things that don't disgust me ... I oppose any intrusion into free speech. Hell, I even oppose almost every ban on this site.
There is as simple way of not viewing Max's work. Don't buy it.
You have the distinction of being the first person I know of who deserved an ADT ban. You don't believe in free speech, so you shouldn't be entitled to it. You disgusted the people on ADT and got exactly what you would do to Max.
_________________________
Amo i Gemelli!!
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#336144 - 06/07/08 11:21 AM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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Quote:
Quote:
There was not a single juror who could be considered a RIGHT winger.
There was no Christian on the jury?
No one whose kid was in a religious parochial school?
There was no creationists?
THOSE ARE ALL RIGHT WING LOONEYS!
You have NO IDEA what these people are.
Being disgusted isn't the issue you complete waste of flesh. Allowing free speech GUARANTEES you will be disgusted. If you can't tolerate being disgusted, you don't merit free speech and should shut up.
I have no problem with OSHA regulating health. I have no problem with California finding porn actors, like mainstream actors, to be employees and not "free lance" when it comes to worker's comp, etc. If providing protection for employees "ruins" the porn industry, TOUGH! Not my issue. Porn will get NO support from me.
I have a problems with people interfering with free speech on any level. We have just gone thru years of being told that if we didn't support this mental midget jeebus freak trying to get revenge for his daddy, you were called a traitor.
That scares me. And, it starts on the fringes and works its way in.
Whether that's Max gagging girls, the battle flag, the Turner Diaries, FOX News or things that don't disgust me ... I oppose any intrusion into free speech. Hell, I even oppose almost every ban on this site.
There is as simple way of not viewing Max's work. Don't buy it.
You have the distinction of being the first person I know of who deserved an ADT ban. You don't believe in free speech, so you shouldn't be entitled to it. You disgusted the people on ADT and got exactly what you would do to Max.
II think your equating all christians as right wing loonies i is as accurat as saying all muslims are fanatatical
terrorists. Its simply not true. Unfortunately for those who share your beliefs, those you disagree with have the same free speech rights as you do.
One might ask, why do they have the right to force their values on us? Thats a good question, but what gives you the right to force YOUR value system on them? Its a two way street.
This supposed bastion of free speech, and you agree with banning someone because they dont agree with you. You just killed any claim you have to free speech. YOU HAVE DONE EXACTLY WHAT THE CHRISIAN RIGHT DOES. YOU NOBETTER THAN THEY ARE
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#336145 - 06/07/08 11:52 AM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Internet Tough Guy
Registered: 07/14/06
Posts: 775
Loc: Hollywood, CA
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Quote:
One might ask, why do they have the right to force their values on us? Thats a good question, but what gives you the right to force YOUR value system on them? Its a two way street.
WTF, I choose to purchase and watch adult material made for adults by adults in MY OWN FUCKING HOUSE, I'm not pushing my values on anyone, who are they to decide what I can watch and not. They came to MAX, he did not go to them, even after numerous warnings on his web site and on his videos they disregarded it all and forced their purist interests on him/us.
The simple truth still stands, IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT, DON"T FUCKING WATCH IT! Their response is NO you can't watch it either, this is my country NOT yours!
Do you honestly think there is not a large majority of people in the US who DO want to watch this, of course there is, what do you say to those people, why do the rights of others trespass over the minority simply because they are in the positions of power?
And don't fall back on the "if you don't like it you need to change the political environment speech" thats a cop out response, simply because we will always be the minority our voice can only be heard by screaming, and its the rule of enforcing the rights of the little people over the popular majority that we should always be concerned with, without that, this country is doomed!
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#336147 - 06/07/08 12:17 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Quote:
Well, i got banned again from ADT. A few good doses of reality and they couldnt handle it. Just because I dont believe in the right wing christian conspiracy, I guess thats not acceptable over there.
And if you think the ADT bois are right wingers, you must think Gunker and Elab are like Nazis. 
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#336148 - 06/07/08 12:30 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Internet Tough Guy
Registered: 07/14/06
Posts: 775
Loc: Hollywood, CA
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Quote:
btw, All people who think God is real are dangerous.
People like Christians & Muslims who think that their path is the only path to God are BEYOND dangerous. And, I will fight all those that would compel me to behave under their code.
Someone made the analogy or inference once that Porn is better for us then Jesus, and I wholeheartedly agree, Religion is about control and separation, it creates the god complex of thinking you are acting for some higher power and this gives you the right to trespass, anything that espouses "this is my Law OBEY" simply based on metaphysical mumbo-jumbo and religious dogma is defective, we all know the reality of that, but so many are raised in these cults they don't know how to think "outside" the box.
Religion at one time was a necessity, now it's just an over indulged opiate.
Porn, is an overindulged opiate, but last time I checked millions of people are not dying for a God simply because I want something to beat off too!
Your scientific advancement is not being halted by porn simply because adults perform sex acts on video.
Porn is not flying planes into buildings in the name of God!
Porn fans are not picketing funerals of dead solders and praising God for killing Fags!
You decide the lesser of two evils.
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#336149 - 06/07/08 02:43 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 03/22/07
Posts: 5186
Loc: Joshua Tree National Park
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Don't think it is only the religious right who is threatening the first amendment. The bible thumpers are not the ones enacting hate speech laws and free speech "zones" on college campuses. That would be the academia and student governments at these universities and colleges the majority of which are on the completely opposite end of the spectrum from the student body at Bob Jones and Liberty Universities. Just because the porn industry is not liable to be under attack if a Democrat is in the White House does not mean that the First Amendment will not be.
_________________________
I would eat Allie Sin's asshole until I got an emotion out of her.-Jerkules
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#336150 - 06/07/08 03:01 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Perv's right: The Dworkins of this world are just as dangerous as the mullahs.
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#336152 - 06/07/08 04:36 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Porn Fucking Master
Registered: 09/19/05
Posts: 3576
Loc: Baltimore, MD
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Aside from the considerable legal and factual complexities of the case, I have long believed that my enemy's enemy is at least an ally, and since I regard the Bush regime and its DoJ as an enemy of liberty, to my mind that makes Max an ally.
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#336153 - 06/07/08 07:01 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Gag Factor Guru
Porn Jesus
Registered: 07/15/05
Posts: 5290
Loc: Dayton
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This is just fucked up.
The two burial flags in my dining room are from my Marine mother and my career Marine father, I am supposed to join my brother and them in Arlington after I'm done. I did two overseas tours in an elite Army intelligence unit, and have worked on defense projects for most of my technical career. I love freedom, and I think I have done enough to say, this is just fucked up.
This current administration has bankrupted this country in so many ways, I have literally cried. I used to report directly to the NSA, and was proud and quiet about it. Now this great weapon is being used against we, the people. I love to hike and camp, well, they've fucked that up every way they can get away with. Consumer protection is overseen by corporate puppets. Poverty is expanding, and so are the prisons. Is our children learning? Not civics, obviously. We use chemical weapons, against innocent civilians, in a country that was no real threat to us. We killed the country's President's sons and displayed the bodies on TV for the world to see, against all military protocol, but are ashamed to show our own fallen soldiers returning home. The ACLU may well spend the rest of my life trying to gain back the freedoms we lost 2001-2004.
And then, the dumbass people, yes, we, the people, re-elected this. With a Republican majority in the legislature.
It makes me cry when I really wonder if I care about the war machines I help improve. I'm a career military/defense person from a career military family, wondering if it is worth defending anymore.
Like always, I'll give we the people one more last chance.
It is well and good to discuss legal technicalities, but this is just fucked up.
If you don't think this stuff with Max is just fucked up, then you don't know your ass from the hole I'll join my father in.
-Chuck, Vegetarian fanboy
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#336154 - 06/07/08 07:50 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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in no way support the outrageous positions of the political right. I just refuse to call them names and I support their right to free speech. Are obscenity laws absurd? of course they are. But they are in FACT the "law of the land". We need to get those laws changed, and by using the over the top retoric,like, "ALL PEOPLE WHO BELIEVE IN GOD ARE DANGEROUS', as stated earlier in this thread you do the argument fon favor.
Why does the political right have the power that they do? Because their are alot of them and they VOTE like minded people into office. If as many people felt as assulted by the right as those here think , then vote your like minded people into office and help change things.
The law is the law and the 12 average people(screened by the defense and prosecution) applied the law as they saw it, given the facts presented. While their decision, based on the LAW, may have been correct, it doesnt even pass the smell test when it comes to being morally correct.
If ALL CHRISTIANS ARE DANGEROUS, i guesss that covers about 75% of all americans. I simply dont think that 75% of all americans are dangerous, Sorry if that upsets people.
first GWB was 'owmed; byt the pharmacutical companies,then the insurance companies,then the right wing took control, and then the oilcompanies etc etc etc. Which is it? I'd put my money on the oil companies over th right wing any day.
And by the way, did one single democrat, or libertarian polititian show any support for MAX? Quick answer...NO
I just dont give the right wing as much credit as the extreme left wing does.
To everyone hear who describes the political right as oversealous right wing nutsjobs, how do you describe yourself.......moderate,left of center, or god forbid extreme left wing bleeding liberal socialist(hhillary). And before you even say it, just because you dissent form my opinion I do not think you are insane, perhaps wrong, but not a loonatic nutjob.
Look at all the political name calling these days. Ever see an L.A. Times newspaper.....in 2007 a study done by a jounalism student at UCLA showed that derogatory terms describing the political right, outnumbered derogaroty terms desctibing the left by over 250 to one, in articles that appeared on the editorial or commentary page. Kind of like here. One single news outlet could be considered right wing and that is FOX. But if you describe Fox as right wing then I would assume that for the sake of fairness you would describe CNN,NBC ABC,CBS MSNBC, AND EVEN COMEDY NETWORK,as (look out here comes the l word)leftis liberal. Oh yeah, the right has a bunch of radio hosts too. The left doesnt have radio hosts because, according to the ratings, nobody wants to listen to all that whining and name calling for hours at a time.
Now please, let the personal attacks begin.
Edited by misterz (06/07/08 08:23 PM)
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#336156 - 06/07/08 08:20 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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)
I'm not interfering with what goes in their houses. They are interfering with what might go in mine.
btw, All people who think God is real are dangerous.
People like Christians & Muslims who think that their path is the only path to God are BEYOND dangerous. And, I will fight all those that would compel me to behave under their code.
My code doesn't compel them to do anything but leave me alone
Observant Christians are America's Taliban. End of Story.
Just for the record, please give me ONE example of how they(the right wing loonies0 have ever in any way had any effect at or 'interfere with what might go on in mine(your house)? And before you cite this verdict remember, it was 12 average people, not the right wing in the deliberation room).
And you really dont see how calling about 50% of all americans (observant chrisians) are akin to the taliban.
And in what way have you ever been 'COMPELLED TO BEHAVE UNDER THEIR CODE?" Just one little example would be ok.
And while we enjoy our porn remember, people who live under differnt codes that you have been 'forced' to accept your codes, as evidenced by the overwheliming availabily of pornography. And i agree, that too bad for them, but I wil not deny their right to 'persue happiness' in the type of society they desire.
Eminence front(its a put on)
And to describe th VOTING process as a COP OUT to getting things changed, well then what do you suggest? How else do you CHANGE things.. Or is screaming all you can do?
And gunker, as usual, as Ive state many times before, when you have been beaten in the debate resort to spell check. Thanks for throwing in the white flag. That just about sums up the level of debate here at xxxporntalk. You guys crack me up.
THE LAWS EXIST. DO SOMETHING CONSTRUCTIVE IF YOU WANT THEM CHANGED, OR JUST KEEP CALLING GWB A MORON IF THATS REALLY THE BEST YOU CAN DO.
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#336157 - 06/07/08 08:26 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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[destro]stop posting[/destro]
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#336159 - 06/07/08 08:53 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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Quote:
misterz,
Quote:
If you don't think this stuff with Max is just fucked up, then you don't know your ass from the hole I'll join my father in.
-Chuck, Vegetarian fanboy
Mob rule morality was dismissed in the 1780's, when the original states demanded a Bill of Rights.
-Chuck, Vegetarian fanboy
+1 The BILL of Rights is the rights that the people give to the government, not the other way around. Any rights not specifically enumerated to the federal govt. explicitly in the constitution are reserved for the stes. Hence we live in an a REPRESENTITIVE REBULIC, not a DEMOCRACY. A true democracy is detrimental to the minority, a republic protects the rights of the monority while still holding to the overall concept 'majority rule." Thats why sometimes someone who doesnt get as many votes as the other guy wins. And that doesnt mean the election was stolen. It actually means, believe it or not, the system works. I know this is a political concept that is probably way to deep for alot of people here, thats why it so frustrating for people like myself to participate on these boards. FUNDAMENTAL misunderstandings of our political process are everywhere here, and when you point that out, people get defensive and lash out with names etc.etc. LIBRARIES REALLY ARE GREAT PLACES. Ever been to one?
Civics 101, something seriously lacking here, in my opinion.
Edited by misterz (06/07/08 08:59 PM)
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#336160 - 06/07/08 08:59 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 01/07/06
Posts: 4268
Loc: Portland
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monority rulz.
_________________________
"My people (the real Americans- descended from the original Angle-Saxon pioneers)"-Coke S.
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#336162 - 06/07/08 09:12 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Quote:
LIBRARIES REALLY ARE GREAT PLACES. Ever been to one?
Panzer hasn't.
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#336164 - 06/08/08 12:57 AM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Whoremaster
Registered: 10/21/05
Posts: 2710
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Quote:
Consumer protection is overseen by corporate puppets. Poverty is expanding, and so are the prisons. Is our children learning? Not civics, obviously.
Grammatical faux pas or clever irony...you be the judge! 
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#336166 - 06/08/08 05:59 AM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Gag Factor Guru
Porn Jesus
Registered: 07/15/05
Posts: 5290
Loc: Dayton
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George W. Bush first asked, " Is our children learning?" -Chuck, Vegetarian fanboy
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#336167 - 06/08/08 08:00 AM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 04/14/06
Posts: 14755
Loc: Busy downloading [LEGALLY!]
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Quote:
If ALL CHRISTIANS ARE DANGEROUS, i guesss that covers about 75% of all americans. I simply dont think that 75% of all americans are dangerous, Sorry if that upsets people.
All OBSERVANT CHRISTIANS are dangerous. They are hardly 75% of the population. They are dangerous because they believe that their "pursuit of happiness" as you put it includes interfering with other people's lives and choices.
Quote:
And in what way have you ever been 'COMPELLED TO BEHAVE UNDER THEIR CODE?" Just one little example would be ok.
- Use of hemp as a fiber is illegal.
- I have to subsidize their churches through tax exemptions.
- I have to deal the with the insertion of the words "under God" into the "Pledge of Allegiance".
- In certain areas, I often cannot buy certain items on their "Sabbath".
- In parts of this country I cannot buy or consume alcohol. [Oddly in some of these parts, they can make it, though ...]
- They would interfere with my right to die.
Other things don't impact me directly such as the economic impact of losing jobs, patents and the lead in technology in stem cell to the EU, China, Japan, Israel, etc., because of their nonsense.
Soon the right of a woman to an abortion might be lost.
If I wanted to be married to two women, I couldn't be. Though, if I wanted to impregnate several and live separately ... well, that's OK.
Certainly unchecked there would be far more problems. This calls for vigilance and active preemption.
I believe that my right to freedom of speech, or anyone else's, should NOT be the province of the tyranny of the majority.
Quote:
how do you describe yourself.......moderate,left of center, or god forbid extreme left wing bleeding liberal socialist(hhillary).
My positions vary on different topics. I'm extreme left wing on most labor issues, many of which I am likely far more socialist than Hillary. I am very right wing on immigration. I supported our involvement in "Desert Storm" and Kosovo. I opposed our involvement in "Desert Freedom".
I don't believe in providing food aid to countries who are not controlling their populations. I don't believe in providing military aid to dictatorships.
I was very active in Bush I's campaign in 1980. I was considered for delegate to the DNC for Clinton in 1992. I supported George Pataki for Governor against Mario Cuomo. I gave money to both McCain and Gore in 2000 and Wesley Clark in 2004.
I would describe my pursuit of freedom as Libertarian since neither the right nor the left is immune to attempting to censor.
_________________________
Amo i Gemelli!!
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#336169 - 06/08/08 12:16 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 01/25/06
Posts: 4470
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Quote:
People like Christians & Muslims who think that their path is the only path to God are BEYOND dangerous. And, I will fight all those that would compel me to behave under their code.
But, but, but, Fattie...it was written in the Bible, so it HAS to be right! That's the way we should all live our lives (according to the religious cuckoos).
Now, let us regress 2000 fucking years. Abracadabra
Don't forget the "Family Values Association (your city here)", Fattie, they're a driving force, too. Wait, they're Christian fucks, too, aren't they?
Corey Taylor sings it best in I'm not Jesus, if what these right wing fags have faith in, "Jesus WASN'T fair".
_________________________
Because you already yelled 'dropping prices!!!' after Red Light canned you. - Gia Jordan to Brandon Iron
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#336171 - 06/08/08 02:54 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Gag Factor Guru
Porn Jesus
Registered: 07/15/05
Posts: 5290
Loc: Dayton
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I believe in God. I try to follow basic spiritual principles. One of those principles is to live and let live.
I tried to be a Methodist, twice. I met some wonderful, spiritual, giving people. Deep down, they reached out to help the community in small ways, not to control it. I did not see a lot of self-righteousness or judgementalism. But, I just cannot accept the basic articles of faith.
I've also seen people turn to religion because they are searching for a cure to a very deep spiritual illness. The illnesses are not addressed, just re-directed into zealotry. This is why these sickness based religious outfits focus on things like porn. This is why they love to have people "witness" by telling stories with shock value and prurient interest. This is why this crowd will go to any lengths, break any type of ethics, to further their agenda. They still hate, because of fear, that is the heart of the sickness.
I've studied the Gospels, and see great beauty in these teachings, they apply to my life to this day. The people I met as a troubled Methodist were close to what I think Jesus would have us do. The troubled group I describe in the last paragraph are very far away from the ideal, and really have no hope, since they don't understand the goals.
Please don't paint all religious with one brush. And allow room in your rhetoric for free-thinking diests like me. I, too, am tempted and sometimes guilty of letting the fear turn into hatred of the sickos. I have found that is counter productive. We need to wall them into their own sick world, just like Max Hardcore is walled into the world of his customers who seek him out.
-Chuck, Vegetarian fanboy
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#336172 - 06/08/08 04:08 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Jesus was a cool cat. I doubt very seriously if he'd recognize the fuckers who "use his name in death," as Jethro Tull's Ian Anderson would have it.
Mohammad, on the other hand, was a fucking psychopath (and a sociopath) and the same goes for most of his followers. I know they're not ALL like that. I just wish the ones who weren't would speak the fuck up.
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#336175 - 06/08/08 05:20 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Internet Tough Guy
Registered: 07/14/06
Posts: 775
Loc: Hollywood, CA
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More attacks by the cross bullies on anything "sexual!" http://thereporter.com/ci_9500406Not-so 'Secret' shoppers Pastor to put store's visitors on YouTube By Melissa Murphy Article Launched: 06/06/2008 05:55:53 AM PDT Click photo to enlarge Jeremy White, of Vacaville, stands outside the Secrets store with his video camera and a sign... * « * 1 * 2 * » "Smile - You're on YouTube." That's the greeting some customers receive as they are about to enter the new Secrets: Lingerie Boutique on East Monte Vista Avenue. The new lingerie/adult store captured plenty of media attention in opening last Friday, just moments before the City Council passed an ordinance enacting a moratorium on adult businesses and the sale of adult products. Since that time, however, it is Vacaville resident Jeremy White and a handful of others who have kept a spotlight on the store - literally. The group periodically sets up a video camera in front of the store to tape people walking into the business. "We are not here because we're against sex or lingerie," White said. "I'm a happily married man and I love both of those things. We're here because the gateway to our city is not the location for a porn shop." White's "YouTube" sign on a black board with white lettering also says "Sex Good, Porn Bad." "I'm not trying to embarrass anybody," White said. "If you have absolutely no question of conscience about entering this store, then by all means shop away. However, if even only one of the dozens of customers we've deterred from entering is a married person about to do something shady behind their spouse's back then - mission accomplished." Secrets District Manager Jim Lukes said Vacaville residents don't have anything to worry about because his store isn't like the Secrets chain stores in Fairfield and Vallejo. "The reality is we're Advertisement not adult," Lukes said. "We're a lingerie store and we're different than those other stores." The group against the business has received mixed reactions in regard to its taping - some by people entering while making obscene gestures to the camera, others by those giving thumbs up and honking in support. On Tuesday afternoon, a handful of Vacaville residents from several different churches gathered together to pray outside the business. "We live in a blessed community," said Kelly Hamilton. "We want to keep it that way." Hamilton and others explained that they've been praying and that they don't wish harm on the employees of Secrets, but that they would like to see the business close. "We hope everybody involved will come out of this with a clean heart," Hamilton said. Resident Laura Granzella agreed. "I don't want us to be seen as a threat," she said. "This isn't personal to the employees, but rather we're a concerned community. "Hopefully the community can grow together through this," Granzella added. Others believe that an adult store next to the highway could damage Vacaville's reputation. "Vacaville is one of the few cities to be known as a family oriented community," said Tim Bittle, a youth pastor at The Father's House. "We don't need businesses like this. If we add stores like this into the equation, we'll turn into other cities. The entrance of Vacaville is not a place for this." White said that although he is a pastor of student ministries at Valley Church, he is peacefully protesting on his own time as a concerned resident. "I think the video is a fun way to talk about an issue that's important to us," he said. "I am aware of youth that struggle with sexual addiction so there is a personal element of heartache - pornography sends a false message to boys and girls." White said the tape will take a little while to edit, but will be posted on YouTube soon.
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#336176 - 06/08/08 05:24 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Quote:
If they did, the others would kill them.
Yeah, that's what Pastor Niemöller said at first:
"In Germany, they came first for the Communists, And I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a Communist;
And then they came for the trade unionists, And I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a trade unionist;
And then they came for the Jews, And I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a Jew;
And then . . . they came for me . . . And by that time there was no one left to speak up."
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#336177 - 06/08/08 05:32 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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[quot
Soon the right of a woman to an abortion might be lost.
If I wanted to be married to two women, I couldn't be. Though, if I wanted to impregnate several and live separately ... well, that's OK.
Certainly unchecked there would be far more problems. This calls for vigilance and active preemption.
I believe that my right to freedom of speech, or anyone else's, should NOT be the province of the tyranny of the majority.
I don't believe in providing food aid to countries who are not controlling their populations. I don't believe in providing military aid to dictatorships.
I would describe my pursuit of freedom as Libertarian since neither the right nor the left is immune to attempting to censor.
Jim, you make some very valid points whith which i wholeheartedly agree. But I do find one major inconsistatntcy in your argument.
You speak about abortion, marriage and children and how you fear the intrusion of the right wing when it comes to your personal choice regarding these matters. These are the most basic of fundamental human rights and NOBODY has the right to interfere with theses choices. I think we agree on that.
But next you say..."I dont believe in providing food aid to countries WHO ARE NOT CONTROLLING THEIR POPULATIONS."
While you worry about a womans right to seek an abortion, you at the sasme time SEEM to advocate that OTHER governments control the very rights that you and I hold so dear in this country, and will kill or die to defend.
Then you describe yourself as LIBERTARIAN To deny people the right to have children is is the grossest human rights violation there is.
How can you possibly reconcile those two positions. You cant tell the U.S. government to stay out of your bedroom, and at the same time INSIST that other governments do exactly that before they recieve your money.
Or is it that your true position is more like, I want everyhing i want and i deserve evverything I want, and to hell with everyone else because I want it.
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#336178 - 06/08/08 05:59 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Ummm.. that was Fatty. I'm the one quoting dead Lutherans.
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#336180 - 06/08/08 06:29 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Quote:
It doesn't take 15 miles of screen scroll to ask Fatman to clarify what he means by countries controlling their populations.
 Chuck Rocks.
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#336181 - 06/08/08 07:05 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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The ultimate joke is that after his conviction is thrown out on appeal....is that not only after the government has misused taxpayer funds to persecute a businessman...operating a legitimate business…...that has also paid his and his companies taxes as well..... That the government that doesn’t want to glorify any aspect of the adult industry has just paid for free advertising for max hardcore for several decades....
The harsh reality is that for all of the government’s effort for any of their so called “wars” is that it just exacerbates the issue more and that finally there is no such thing as bad publicity.
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#336182 - 06/08/08 07:58 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Max Hardcore Prison Bitch
Registered: 02/15/07
Posts: 259
Loc: in your white wife
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Quote:
More attacks by the cross bullies on anything "sexual!"
http://thereporter.com/ci_9500406
Not-so 'Secret' shoppers
Pastor to put store's visitors on YouTube
By Melissa Murphy
Article Launched: 06/06/2008 05:55:53 AM PDT
Click photo to enlarge
Jeremy White, of Vacaville, stands outside the Secrets store with his video camera and a sign...
* «
* 1
* 2
* »
"Smile - You're on YouTube."
That's the greeting some customers receive as they are about to enter the new Secrets: Lingerie Boutique on East Monte Vista Avenue.
The new lingerie/adult store captured plenty of media attention in opening last Friday, just moments before the City Council passed an ordinance enacting a moratorium on adult businesses and the sale of adult products.
Since that time, however, it is Vacaville resident Jeremy White and a handful of others who have kept a spotlight on the store - literally. The group periodically sets up a video camera in front of the store to tape people walking into the business.
"We are not here because we're against sex or lingerie," White said. "I'm a happily married man and I love both of those things. We're here because the gateway to our city is not the location for a porn shop."
White's "YouTube" sign on a black board with white lettering also says "Sex Good, Porn Bad."
"I'm not trying to embarrass anybody," White said. "If you have absolutely no question of conscience about entering this store, then by all means shop away. However, if even only one of the dozens of customers we've deterred from entering is a married person about to do something shady behind their spouse's back then - mission accomplished."
Secrets District Manager Jim Lukes said Vacaville residents don't have anything to worry about because his store isn't like the Secrets chain stores in Fairfield and Vallejo.
"The reality is we're
Advertisement
not adult," Lukes said. "We're a lingerie store and we're different than those other stores."
The group against the business has received mixed reactions in regard to its taping - some by people entering while making obscene gestures to the camera, others by those giving thumbs up and honking in support.
On Tuesday afternoon, a handful of Vacaville residents from several different churches gathered together to pray outside the business.
"We live in a blessed community," said Kelly Hamilton. "We want to keep it that way."
Hamilton and others explained that they've been prayin
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#336183 - 06/08/08 08:00 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Max Hardcore Prison Bitch
Registered: 02/15/07
Posts: 259
Loc: in your white wife
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Quote:
More attacks by the cross bullies on anything "sexual!"
http://thereporter.com/ci_9500406
Not-so 'Secret' shoppers
Pastor to put store's visitors on YouTube
By Melissa Murphy
Article Launched: 06/06/2008 05:55:53 AM PDT
Click photo to enlarge
Jeremy White, of Vacaville, stands outside the Secrets store with his video camera and a sign...
* «
* 1
* 2
* »
"Smile - You're on YouTube."
That's the greeting some customers receive as they are about to enter the new Secrets: Lingerie Boutique on East Monte Vista Avenue.
The new lingerie/adult store captured plenty of media attention in opening last Friday, just moments before the City Council passed an ordinance enacting a moratorium on adult businesses and the sale of adult products.
Since that time, however, it is Vacaville resident Jeremy White and a handful of others who have kept a spotlight on the store - literally. The group periodically sets up a video camera in front of the store to tape people walking into the business.
"We are not here because we're against sex or lingerie," White said. "I'm a happily married man and I love both of those things. We're here because the gateway to our city is not the location for a porn shop."
White's "YouTube" sign on a black board with white lettering also says "Sex Good, Porn Bad."
"I'm not trying to embarrass anybody," White said. "If you have absolutely no question of conscience about entering this store, then by all means shop away. However, if even only one of the dozens of customers we've deterred from entering is a married person about to do something shady behind their spouse's back then - mission accomplished."
Secrets District Manager Jim Lukes said Vacaville residents don't have anything to worry about because his store isn't like the Secrets chain stores in Fairfield and Vallejo.
"The reality is we're
Advertisement
not adult," Lukes said. "We're a lingerie store and we're different than those other stores."
The group against the business has received mixed reactions in regard to its taping - some by people entering while making obscene gestures to the camera, others by those giving thumbs up and honking in support.
On Tuesday afternoon, a handful of Vacaville residents from several different churches gathered together to pray outside the business.
"We live in a blessed community," said Kelly Hamilton. "We want to keep it that way."
Hamilton and others explained that they've been praying and that they don't wish harm on the employees of Secrets, but that they would like to see the business close.
"We hope everybody involved will come out of this with a clean heart," Hamilton said.
Resident Laura Granzella agreed.
"I don't want us to be seen as a threat," she said. "This isn't personal to the employees, but rather we're a concerned community.
"Hopefully the community can grow together through this," Granzella added.
Others believe that an adult store next to the highway could damage Vacaville's reputation.
"Vacaville is one of the few cities to be known as a family oriented community," said Tim Bittle, a youth pastor at The Father's House. "We don't need businesses like this. If we add stores like this into the equation, we'll turn into other cities. The entrance of Vacaville is not a place for this."
White said that although he is a pastor of student ministries at Valley Church, he is peacefully protesting on his own time as a concerned resident.
"I think the video is a fun way to talk about an issue that's important to us," he said. "I am aware of youth that struggle with sexual addiction so there is a personal element of heartache - pornography sends a false message to boys and girls."
White said the tape will take a little while to edit, but will be posted on YouTube soon.
how are they not hurting the employees if they are trying to put them out of a job in a fucked up economy.The fear of being like other citys is pathatic even pensacola has titty bars. 
They are'nt the only ones in the country doing shit like this depriving people of there freedom of expression.
In Texas there is a pastor taping people coming out of a porn shop the scary part is he works with the police so he finds out what addresses of the customers then sends them mail hoping if they're married they get busted.  no one likes a snitch
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#336184 - 06/08/08 08:03 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Max Hardcore Prison Bitch
Registered: 02/15/07
Posts: 259
Loc: in your white wife
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#336185 - 06/08/08 09:57 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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Quote:
Ummm.. that was Fatty. I'm the one quoting dead Lutherans.
my bad lutherans are DANGEROUS people. Im Catholic, or could you have guessed. have a good day
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#336186 - 06/08/08 10:08 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Yeah, man. I totally feel ya. Just last week, a van full of Lutherans drove down my block, pulled in front of the Presbyterian church and squeezed off about a dozen rounds before hightailing it out of there.
I, for one, was scared.
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#336187 - 06/08/08 11:53 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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Quote:
It doesn't take 15 miles of screen scroll to ask Fatman to clarify what he means by countries controlling their populations.
=Chuck, Vegetarian fanboy
By "clarify" do you mean backpeddle, and try to explain how depriving other peoples reproductive rights in poor developing countries is somehow going to protect those very rights we have here. Total freedom for us lucky americans, and "population control" for others. Very Libertarian indeed. Sounds a little more Talibanish to me. Oh, wait, GWB is the taliban,right.
It is people with that type of mentality that pose much more danger to the "erosion" of our rights than the bible thumpers ever will. In my opinion.
A "LIBERTARIAN" advocating 'population control". Now to anyone who TRUELY understands Libertarianism, thatis the funniest thing I've ever heard. If there were such a thing as a card carrying libertarian,,the party would ask for your card back.
Yes, the right wing is full of shit. I just dont fear them as much as everyone here, adn I dont believe they have the power that many here give them credit for.
Or perhaps the Fatman can explain, or CLAIFY, for all of us how wonderfully that communist china "population control" program is working out.
Like any vice, taken too far its gets dangerous,and can take a toll physically and mentally on people. I am not advocating taking the choice to do those things away, I'm just being honest by saying that YES, these things are bad for you. Go ahead and do it, but dont tell me it doesnt cause any problems for individuals and society in genereal.(gambling,drugs,porn,etc.etc.)
Edited by misterz (06/09/08 12:03 AM)
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#336188 - 06/09/08 02:16 AM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 04/14/06
Posts: 14755
Loc: Busy downloading [LEGALLY!]
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Then you describe yourself as LIBERTARIAN To deny people the right to have children is is the grossest human rights violation there is.
How can you possibly reconcile those two positions. You cant tell the U.S. government to stay out of your bedroom, and at the same time INSIST that other governments do exactly that before they recieve your money.
Or is it that your true position is more like, I want everyhing i want and i deserve evverything I want, and to hell with everyone else because I want it.
No. If your rights require financial subsidy it's not your "right". If it requires my money for you to express your "rights", I should get a say in your actions.
You want 50 kids and it won't cost me a dime? Great!
If you cannot afford a lifestyle choice, why should I be required to subsidize it?
I don't think you have the right to have children if you cannot support them. Sorry. Once again, that's someone else's "right" that compels for my compliance. It interferes in my Life.
Their "right" directly costs me money I'd rather spend elsewhere. That's sticking their hand directly into my pocket to pay for their choices.
If you can't afford a kid and you elect to have one anyway, I can choose not to help you. If others feel that you should, they set up foundations, put up their money and leave me out.
Max isn't asking for federal subsidy or tax breaks to make his porn. The federal government should not be under any obligation to provide him with money to pursue his "art". They should not pay for DVDs for people who want to watch his porn.
If such things existed, in my opinion opponents of this lifestyle choice could rightfully say "I don't want to pay for that".
Can you understand the difference, at long last?
I said I was Libertarian on free speech. As was evidenced in the array of canidates I've supported, my views are not contrained to any one ideology.
Having kids isn't speech or art or expression.
I think that if developing countries controlled their population, they would get out of poverty faster. At this rate, they'll never get out of poverty. Controlling population is being mature and responsible.
Most middle-class Americans limit the number of children to what they can afford. There's no reason that cannot happen in the third world.
EDIT: btw, I'm not FORCING them to stop having kids. I'm just not going to pay for them. They can still "express themselves" and have as many as they want ... WITHOUT MY MONEY.
They can do what they want ...
I can do what I want ...
Perfect. 
_________________________
Amo i Gemelli!!
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#336190 - 06/09/08 11:12 AM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 01/25/06
Posts: 4470
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So, my question to the good pastor & his wholesome minions of the lawdy god...
Where exactly DO these businesses belong, if not on a stretch of highway where they can attract patrons?
Would they be better suited in a warehouse district, or some dirty old city, a ghetto? Please, suggest. This is the problem with media today. No one ever has a solution other than "close 'em down". My question is "where should we relocate, and are you do-gooders willing to pay the costs associated with moving us (moving, new building, sale of the old one, etc.)?"
Quote:
But next you say..."I dont believe in providing food aid to countries WHO ARE NOT CONTROLLING THEIR POPULATIONS."
While you worry about a womans right to seek an abortion, you at the sasme time SEEM to advocate that OTHER governments control the very rights that you and I hold so dear in this country, and will kill or die to defend.
I didn't get that out of Fattie's post whatsoever. Showing how differently you read that proves how fucking stupid you are.
I understood it to mean that THEY can fuck like jackrabbits until their balls turn bruise purple. However, WE shouldn't be funding their ignorance of continually producing new mouths to feed. Obviously, hunger is going to be a problem in a country where they are getting pregnant just for the hell of it.
I'd rather they kill themselves off through starvation, maybe than they'd get a fucking clue. By enabling them (with funding for food), they're just useless niggers utilizing the good samaritaism of others like those same parties take advantage of the welfare system within our own borders.
_________________________
Because you already yelled 'dropping prices!!!' after Red Light canned you. - Gia Jordan to Brandon Iron
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#336191 - 06/09/08 11:49 AM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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Quote:
Quote:
Then you describe yourself as LIBERTARIAN To deny people the right to have children is is the grossest human rights violation there is.
How can you possibly reconcile those two positions. You cant tell the U.S. government to stay out of your bedroom, and at the same time INSIST that other governments do exactly that before they recieve your money.
Or is it that your true position is more like, I want everyhing i want and i deserve evverything I want, and to hell with everyone else because I want it.
No. If your rights require financial subsidy it's not your "right". If it requires my money for you to express your "rights", I should get a say in your actions.
You want 50 kids and it won't cost me a dime? Great!
If you cannot afford a lifestyle choice, why should I be required to subsidize it?
I don't think you have the right to have children if you cannot support them. Sorry. Once again, that's someone else's "right" that compels for my compliance. It interferes in my Life.
Their "right" directly costs me money I'd rather spend elsewhere. That's sticking their hand directly into my pocket to pay for their choices.
If you can't afford a kid and you elect to have one anyway, I can choose not to help you. If others feel that you should, they set up foundations, put up their money and leave me out.
Max isn't asking for federal subsidy or tax breaks to make his porn. The federal government should not be under any obligation to provide him with money to pursue his "art". They should not pay for DVDs for people who want to watch his porn.
If such things existed, in my opinion opponents of this lifestyle choice could rightfully say "I don't want to pay for that".
Can you understand the difference, at long last?
I said I was Libertarian on free speech. As was evidenced in the array of canidates I've supported, my views are not contrained to any one ideology.
Having kids isn't speech or art or expression.
I think that if developing countries controlled their population, they would get out of poverty faster. At this rate, they'll never get out of poverty. Controlling population is being mature and responsible.
Most middle-class Americans limit the number of children to what they can afford. There's no reason that cannot happen in the third world.
EDIT: btw, I'm not FORCING them to stop having kids. I'm just not going to pay for them. They can still "express themselves" and have as many as they want ... WITHOUT MY MONEY.
They can do what they want ...
I can do what I want ...
Perfect.
You seem tovequate exercising fundamental human rights with having money. Personally, I think we should stop all forieghn aid, but thats another issue.
But nowhere in your reply do you answer the question, What sould those other governments do to "control their population" as YOU say. Forced steriliZation, forced abortions(welcome to china,fatman)....As a matter of fact, in your reply you dont evenmention YOUR phrase,"control the poplulation'
I'm sorry, but in my book your position on any FREEDOM issues is hugely compromised when you even suggest that government should 'control the poulaion.'
You say your "views are not constrained to one ideology" I agree. It alson seems that you embrace the ideology of communist china when it comes to 'population control." Then in your response you ssy,"Im not forcing them to stop having kids......." Well genius, what do you think government population control is?
1. Why did you not mention population control in your backpeddle response?
2. What means do you suggest ohter countries take to control their population?(criminalize people for having too many childre, forced sterilizations and abortions)
3. Does anyone here agree with Fatman, that governmetns should 'control the populaion'?
Hey fatman, should MY tax dollars pay for some other kids education? I dont have kids, so should I have to give MY money to public schools to educate other peopls kids?
I think the overall selfishness, and ME first at all costs, of your so called political ideology, as unsustainable as it is(freedom for ME poulation control for you), is typical of the extreme left, and you would be better suited to explore YOUR own hypocrisy.
And regarding "sticking their hands into my pockets<' we all play for things we dontl like with our taxes,, Did you ever have a kid in pulic schools, or did you or anyone you know ever go to public schools? How do you feel about the people who pay for their own kids to go to private school, but also have to pay for your kids to go to public school?Heck, according to your belief, if they cant afford to educate their own kids then, like YOU said, I DONT THINK YOU HAVE THE RIGHT TO HAVE CHILDREN IF YOU CANT AFFORD THEM." Ah yes, the more money you have, the more rights you have. Who here agrees with that? And who makes that desicion? YOU!!!! Oh wait, you want the government to make that decision.(population control).
Oh wait, Im sorry, you did mention population control in your reply..."I think that if developing countries CONTROLLED their population they would get out of poverty faster? (how does this statement correlate to your statement.."I;m not forcing them to stop haveing kids.) Again I ask you, o mister libertarian defender of freedom, exactly how should these governments 'control the population? Should they use 'any means necessary?'
Freedom and human rights for all(that is all who can AFFORD it according to fatman) The last time I cheked the Constitiution didnt have a pricetag. YOUR ideology is far scarier than the religious right, in my opinion. By any chance, do you speak chinese?
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#336193 - 06/09/08 11:57 AM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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I didn't get that out of Jim's post whatsoever. I understood it to mean that we should be controlling their population, rather that we just shouldn't be funding their ignorance of continually producing new life. [/quote
To suggest any type of 'population controlby the government' ours or any other,is patently offensive to anyone who believes in any freedom at all. If you think any government whould in any way 'control the population" then I guess i really dont know how to argue with that. How could you possibly advocate giving any government that type of authority. It boggle my mind.
Stay out of MY bedroom, but dont say out of theirs. A very very veryvery very hypocritical philosophy. And you all say you want to defend freedoms? What a joke.
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#336195 - 06/09/08 12:00 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 01/25/06
Posts: 4470
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Touche fucker, it's already been edited to clarify what I meant.
What's up with your inability to 'quote' properly anyway?
_________________________
Because you already yelled 'dropping prices!!!' after Red Light canned you. - Gia Jordan to Brandon Iron
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#336197 - 06/09/08 12:06 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 01/25/06
Posts: 4470
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Is it just me, but...?
Misterz seems good with words (when he can edit them), but his typographical grammer sucks turgid moose penis?
BTW, do you even understand the concept behind the public school system? It's an opportunity for EVERYONE to get an education, not just those who can afford it. If the government didn't assist, we'd have a nation full of dummies. The bigger problem is, those who CAN afford a private education are usually leaching off the system, and thus their children become the average dummy, too.
_________________________
Because you already yelled 'dropping prices!!!' after Red Light canned you. - Gia Jordan to Brandon Iron
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#336198 - 06/09/08 12:08 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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Quote:
Touche fucker, it's already been edited to clarify what I meant.
What's up with your inability to 'quote' properly anyway?
What a great comeback. I'm speechless. You've obviously got some great intellectual insight that few here could ever dream of matching. The only problem is, you wouldnt dare say that to someones face, but behind a keyboard you're a real warrior. I now third graders who have more insight inot the harsh realities of real life than you. But why am I talking about reality here in fantasy land. After al, this is the place where people dont think Max Hardcore vidoes are obscene. Talk about denial. You guys crakc me up, youre like the clowns on the bicycle at the circus, always peddling backwards.
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#336199 - 06/09/08 12:13 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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Quote:
Is it just me, but...?
Misterz seems good with words (when he can edit them), but his typographical grammer sucks turgid moose penis?
And As i have stated before, when you have no argument against the substance of a post, then attack the grammer and puntuation. Any time anyone does that it is just like saying, " Of course you are correct, but I dont like it and I cant intelligentyl rebut the argument, so I'll just call you a fucker and believe that I win the argument.
I think you are truely full of Jack Shit, but you sure do spell good. Oh wait, I see a "mother' comment coming.
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#336200 - 06/09/08 12:13 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 01/25/06
Posts: 4470
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Quote:
The only problem is, you wouldnt dare say that to someones face, but behind a keyboard you're a real warrior.
Wanna bet? And if I did, what recourse do you have (in mind), eh?
Quote:
I now third graders who have more insight inot the harsh realities of real life than you.
Please explain this word, I've never seen it before.
You backpedal just as much as anyone else, it shows in your 'edited by' at the end of each post. The only thing you lack, mental warrior, is your ability to spell or type correctly.
Your haste in typing out the steam you're blowing off as a result of our brow-beating is comical.
_________________________
Because you already yelled 'dropping prices!!!' after Red Light canned you. - Gia Jordan to Brandon Iron
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#336201 - 06/09/08 12:20 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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Quote:
The bigger problem is, those who CAN afford a private education are usually leaching off the system, and thus their children become the average dummy, too.
I understand your argument that pulci education is needed to fundamently maintain society. But to say that those who could afford private education are somehow LEECHES is absurd. Most people i know who can afford it get their kids out of public shools as fast as they can. But to call someone a LEECH for using the programs that THEIR money pays for, is ridiculous. There seems to be alot of CLASS ENVY here, and if you dont see the danger in equating exercising ones righta with the fatness of ones wallet, then i would have to think that youre a product of the public school system and are just one of those "average dummies."
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#336202 - 06/09/08 12:23 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 01/25/06
Posts: 4470
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Yup, I agree.
So did yo' mama when I asked her about you, oh carnal encyclopedia.
_________________________
Because you already yelled 'dropping prices!!!' after Red Light canned you. - Gia Jordan to Brandon Iron
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#336203 - 06/09/08 12:26 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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Quote:
Quote:
The only problem is, you wouldnt dare say that to someones face, but behind a keyboard you're a real warrior.
Wanna bet? And if I did, what recourse do you have (in mind), eh?
Quote:
I now third graders who have more insight inot the harsh realities of real life than you.
Please explain this word, I've never seen it before.
You backpedal just as much as anyone else, it shows in your 'edited by' at the end of each post. The only thing you lack, mental warrior, is your ability to spell or type correctly.
Your haste in typing out the steam you're blowing off as a result of our brow-beating is comical.
I'm so hurt, youve attacked my typing skills. If you realy were that smart, you would notice that the majority of my mistakes are dyslexic in nature. For example, writing "inot" instead of "into" or hitting the "l" button when I should hit the "S". Yes, I am severely dyslexic. I'm sorry if you think that diminishes the arguments I make.As if it makes your points any more valid.
And I never changed the substane of a post with editing. Sometimes i fix grammer, spelling, or add a sentence or two, but i have NEVER changed the substance of a post by editing it. I have also used the edit to remove personal swipes Ive taken at people a few times. But, good try though. In my eyes you have truel and beyond any and all doubt proved that you are indeed the one and ony JACK SHIT
.
So keep on attacking my spelling. It really does make you look smart goober. And anytime you want to get together just pm me. I will gladly fly you here to L.A. from anywhere so we can have alittle face time. Ican AFFORD it, so I guess its my RIGHT to offer it.
Edited by misterz (06/09/08 12:34 PM)
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#336204 - 06/09/08 12:35 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 01/25/06
Posts: 4470
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There is that neat little email that floats around saying how you still manage to read a message even if the whole thing were misspelled.
However, El G's posts are more legible than your own. That's bad when I have to double take at your diatribes to understand them.
_________________________
Because you already yelled 'dropping prices!!!' after Red Light canned you. - Gia Jordan to Brandon Iron
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#336206 - 06/09/08 01:06 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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Quote:
There is that neat little email that floats around saying how you still manage to read a message even if the whole thing were misspelled.
However, El G's posts are more legible than your own. That's bad when I have to double take at your diatribes to understand them.
You could do double, triple, as many takes as you want, I doubt you could ever understand them. They contain thoughts that are much to complicated for you to mentally process.
And your attempted propoganda type useage of the word diatribe, to describe my posts is actually very facist in nature. When you cant argue with the substance then go after the messanger, and use dismissive comments to try to bellittle the argument that you have still neve addressed.
Maybe you should be an English teacher. Oh wait, who here would want you around their kids all day?
And from now on I am going to do my best to spell correctly. That way you willhave absolutely nothing to debate with me, because you surely cant't win on the merits of your positions.
Edited by misterz (06/09/08 01:10 PM)
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#336208 - 06/09/08 01:10 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 08/09/06
Posts: 9113
Loc: red dirt state of mind
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He's not misspelling, he's catholic, so you know he's just drunk.
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#336209 - 06/09/08 01:12 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Quote:
You seem tovequate exercising fundamental human rights with having money....
<snip>
...By any chance, do you speak chinese?
I'm sorry. I couldn't read any of that in the middle. But the parts above are one of the funniest things I've seen on XPT in months. Thank You.
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#336210 - 06/09/08 01:14 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Quote:
I didn't get that out of Jim's post whatsoever...
AGAIN: That's Fatty, not me. I just quoted from a guy who learned the hard way about speaking out.
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#336211 - 06/09/08 01:28 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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Quote:
Quote:
And As i have stated before, when you have no argument against the substance of a post, then attack the grammer and puntuation. Any time anyone does that it is just like saying, " Of course you are correct, but I dont like it and I cant intelligentyl rebut the argument, so I'll just call you a fucker and believe that I win the argument.
I think you are truely full of Jack Shit, but you sure do spell good. Oh wait, I see a "mother' comment coming.
Isn't that something you only do on 4th and long? Seriously dude, it's hard to follow your argument when you type like this. I just keep hearing your words in Chris Burke's voice...
Wow, you guys here get really desperate when someone comes in and shoots your arguments to hell. Is this really the BEST you can do? I guess so. I dont't really think the problem is my spelling, I think the problem is my opinion, while contrary to yours, holds more water and makes more sense than you're willing to admit. I freely admit that many opinions, and responses to my opinions have alot of merit and make some good points, I wonder if anybody here will say the same about me?
Like I said in another thread, some things are just too complicated to be intelligently disscussed here.
And while yes, my spelling and punctualtion leaves alot to be desired, you must be really mentally challenged if that is what makes the substacne of the post so difficult for you to undestand. I contend that it would be hard for you to follow my arguments regardless of the grammar.
Now that you have failed in your attempt to derail the argument lets get back to the basic question.
Do you believe, as fatman does, that GOVERNMENTS should 'control the population?" And if so, then how? And how does that position reconcile with all of the freedoms that everyone here is saying are being eroded here?
Edited by misterz (06/09/08 01:30 PM)
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#336212 - 06/09/08 01:31 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Gag Factor Guru
Porn Jesus
Registered: 07/15/05
Posts: 5290
Loc: Dayton
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Quote:
After al, this is the place where people dont think Max Hardcore vidoes are obscene. Talk about denial. You guys crakc me up, youre like the clowns on the bicycle at the circus, always peddling backwards.
I'll tell you what's obscene.
My lady AA friends do it right, they never break a confidence. But they have shared with me in a general way some demons some of the new women face. There is REAL sexual and physical abuse in this community, and no doubt in yours. And I never hear about the non-alcoholic women, the single mothers who struggle because they left an abusive situation. And while resources remain very thin for these abused and forgotten women, the feds spend like drunken sailors to control what some old asshole like me masturbates to. Because there is a consensual depiction of abuse.
That's obscene.
-Chuck, Vegetarian fanboy
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#336213 - 06/09/08 01:31 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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Quote:
Quote:
You seem tovequate exercising fundamental human rights with having money....
<snip>
I got to give you that one JIM.
...By any chance, do you speak chinese?
I'm sorry. I couldn't read any of that in the middle. But the parts above are one of the funniest things I've seen on XPT in months. Thank You.
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#336214 - 06/09/08 01:38 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Quote:
Wow, you guys here get really desperate when someone comes in and shoots your arguments to hell.
Perhaps. But that hasn't happened here.
Quote:
Is this really the BEST you can do?
Not by a long shot, Skippy.
Quote:
I dont't really think the problem is my spelling
Ummm... yeah it is. Your grammar and syntax aren't much to write home about, either.
Quote:
I think the problem is my opinion...
If I could figure out what the hell you were talking about, I might be inclined to agree. Would you be so kind as to "CLAIFY" your position a bit?
Quote:
Some things are just too complicated to be intelligently disscussed here.
How would you know?
Quote:
And whil yes, my spelling and punctualtion leaves alot to be desired, you must be really mentally challenged if that is what makes the substacne of the post so difficult for you to undestand.
In addition to English, I speak Spanish, Porn Whore and some German. And for the life of me, I have no idea what you're going on about. It's funny as Hell, though.
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#336215 - 06/09/08 01:42 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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Quote:
Quote:
After al, this is the place where people dont think Max Hardcore vidoes are obscene. Talk about denial. You guys crakc me up, youre like the clowns on the bicycle at the circus, always peddling backwards.
I'll tell you what's obscene.
My lady AA friends do it right, they never break a confidence. But they have shared with me in a general way some demons some of the new women face. There is REAL sexual and physical abuse in this community, and no doubt in yours. And I never hear about the non-alcoholic women, the single mothers who struggle because they left an abusive situation. And while resources remain very thin for these abused and forgotten women, the feds spend like drunken sailors to control what some old asshole like me masturbates to. Because there is a consensual depiction of abuse.
That's obscene.
-Chuck, Vegetarian fanboy
I agree, those resources could be used elswhere, like to help the people you mentioned. Of course if Fatman was in charge, he'd say even they shouldnt get that help because they shouldnt have had children if they couldnt afford it. Asd a matter of fact he said,, They should not have the RIGHT to have children if they couldnt afford it.
p.s. I have never worked in any way in the adult industry.
And while we're at it, after the government, who is it that most people in the situation you describe turn to? Usually family first and then, oh no, hold your hats, their local church. But wait, as stated earlier, ALL CHRISTIANS ARE DANGEROUS. (i forgot about that tidbit of wisdom from one of the resident scholars here at xxxporntalk)
And I say the oil companies control GWB a hell of alot more than the right wing.
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#336216 - 06/09/08 01:44 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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I take it you don't disagree, then.
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#336217 - 06/09/08 01:52 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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Quote:
Quote:
Wow, you guys here get really desperate when someone comes in and shoots your arguments to hell.
Perhaps. But that hasn't happened here.
Quote:
Is this really the BEST you can do?
Not by a long shot, Skippy.
Quote:
I dont't really think the problem is my spelling
Ummm... yeah it is. Your grammar and syntax aren't much to write home about, either.
Quote:
I think the problem is my opinion...
If I could figure out what the hell you were talking about, I might be inclined to agree. Would you be so kind as to "CLAIFY" your position a bit?
Quote:
Some things are just too complicated to be intelligently disscussed here.
How would you know?
Quote:
And whil yes, my spelling and punctualtion leaves alot to be desired, you must be really mentally challenged if that is what makes the substacne of the post so difficult for you to undestand.
In addition to English, I speak Spanish, Porn Whore and some German. And for the life of me, I have no idea what you're going on about. It's funny as Hell, though.
THANK-YOU, THANK-YOU THANK-YOU
For proving my point in your, oh so simple way. The fact that you yourself admit that you cant comprehend the substance of my argument is all the validation I need to know that I am right. And that spelling and grammar argument, now thats funny. But if thats the best you can do, and that is all you have done, then who am I to argue with that. Did you watch the national spelling bee this weekend? I would think that someone who equates the validity of an argument with the spelling used to express it would have been glued to their tv set. Or were the words actually a bit to c.o.m.p.l.i.c.a.t.e.d for you?
Edited by misterz (06/09/08 01:55 PM)
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#336218 - 06/09/08 01:58 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Right. You win. 
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#336219 - 06/09/08 02:01 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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Quote:
Right. You win.
Actually Jim we all lose.(or is it loose...lol). But when as serious as a debate as this could have been gets thrown into the gutter by attacking ones syntax and punctuation, we all lose. Better luck next time.
The fact is, I agree with about 80% of what everyone else posted here, and I give them 'props' for that, and at least I will admit that. Will others do the same? Doubt it.
Edited by misterz (06/09/08 02:05 PM)
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#336221 - 06/09/08 02:07 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Edited by Jim B. (06/09/08 05:07 PM)
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#336222 - 06/09/08 02:17 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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Quote:
In the middle of page 5, I handed you your ass, and a picture where there are lots of holes in the ground. You still don't know the difference. Your arguments are no better than your pitiful use of words. But I thank you, I don't want to suffer the consequences of kicking a federal prosecutor in the balls, but laughing at a complete dumbass like you is the next best thing. I feel better.
-Chuck, Vegetarian fanboy [/quot
I salute you and your families sacrifices. They are honorable and truely worthy of merit. It does NOT however make your opinions any less or more valid than anyone elses.(you did not say that, I'm just pointing it out)
What do you think of 'government control" of the population?
And how come NOBODY here will answer that? Is it because your asnwer would probably be more in line (not necessarily identical) with my opinion than Fatmans. Or am I just not spelling enough words for you to have the GUTS that any marine would have and answer the question? So please, lets hear your reply to the question. It would probably be one of the more articulate and educated responses here, but you probably wont because you dont want to be seen as agreeing with me.
The freedom of speech that you and your family fought for also gives you the freedom on silence. Which do you choose?
As far as who is getting handed who's ass, I have been dishing them out left and right.
Be a MARINE, stand up, and answer the simple question above, or remain silent.
Some people stand up for the first ammendment, others hide behind it. I would expect you to stand up for it.
p.s. I have family buried their too. That DOESNT make me special.
Edited by misterz (06/09/08 02:22 PM)
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#336223 - 06/09/08 02:22 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Quote:
What do you think of 'government control" of the population?
You've said this several times. Please show me where Fatman advocates, or even suggests, "government control of the population." I can't find it anywhere. Neither can anyone else. Please explain, oh enlightened one.
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#336224 - 06/09/08 02:34 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Gag Factor Guru
Porn Jesus
Registered: 07/15/05
Posts: 5290
Loc: Dayton
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I was never a Marine, I was in an Army intelligence unit. My military bona fides were to show that I love freedom, and make it my business to protect it.
Population control is a complicated subject, way off topic here. The Chinese have made some tough choices, I've not studied the issue in depth. My hopes for most of the world would be that education and availability of birth control would go a very long way. Community health agencies need to help out here, and have classes, counseling, etc.
Folks on your side who advocate the global gag rule, and a Pope who says wearing a condom is a sin, are not helping things at all. But I don't think letting the children starve is the answer, except in a Libertarian utopia, which I don't support, either. I'm a classic liberal, with emphasis on civil liberties.
I have to go take a final exam at a Community College. I have a B.S., but I continue to learn. You should try some additional formal education, I've found it to be a lifelong joy.
-Chuck, Vegetarian fanboy
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#336226 - 06/09/08 02:41 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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Quote:
Quote:
What do you think of 'government control" of the population?
You've said this several times. Please show me where Fatman advocates, or even suggests, "government control of the population." I can't find it anywhere. Neither can anyone else. Please explain, oh enlightened one.
On page 5 of this thread he writes...."I dont believe in providing food aid to countries that arent "controling their poplulation."
on page 6 he writes...."I think that if developing countries "controlled their population" they would get out of povery faster.
Now if you dont understand that government population control is the most dangerous concept anywhere in the political spectrum, then there is no need to go any further.
Even for the reasons espoused by fatman (ending poverty) the ends could never justify the means. And my question taht no one here has the guts to answer is "what would those means have to be in order to accomplish Fatmans goal of 'controling the population? One need to look no farther that China to get the answer.
He also said that hel believes that if you cannot afford children then you should not have the RIGHT to have them. Granting basic rights only to those who can afford them. Sounds alot like the communist manifesto....."from each according to his abilities, to each according to his needs'........except it is the government who decides which is which.
Now, do you agree with Fatman or not. Or will you too exercise your right to slilence.
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#336227 - 06/09/08 02:55 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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FATMAN NOW SAYS (insert backpedal here)
If you can't afford a kid, I believe you should choose not have one. Sorry. I don't believe in a welfare state. I don't see welfare as a righ
I wholeheartedly agree withyour post. I hate the 'welfare state' that we have created as much as the next guy.
But in the above statemant you say if you cant afford a kid you should choose not to have one, but earliet you said, an I quote "I dont think you have the RIGHT to have children if you cant afford them." Sounds like some major backpedaling to me. Or are you just 'clarifying your position.
Then you talk about governments 'controlling the population" to help end poverty.
Simple question, what actions should these governments be allowed to take to control their populations as you say they should, and how does that reconcile with your...."leave me alone in my bedroom" philosophy. Now get back on that bike an continue backpdealling.
And ive actually decided not to monitor my grammar like I said I would because I find it too funny when that is the only response i get. Wow, i guess i backpedaled on that one.
Edited by misterz (06/09/08 02:59 PM)
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#336229 - 06/09/08 03:14 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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Quote:
I was never a Marine, I was in an Army intelligence unit. My military bona fides were to show that I love freedom, and make it my business to protect it.
Population control is a complicated subject, way off topic here. The Chinese have made some tough choices, I've not studied the issue in depth. My hopes for most of the world would be that education and availability of birth control would go a very long way. Community health agencies need to help out here, and have classes, counseling, etc.
Folks on your side who advocate the global gag rule, and a Pope who says wearing a condom is a sin, are not helping things at all. But I don't think letting the children starve is the answer, except in a Libertarian utopia, which I don't support, either. I'm a classic liberal, with emphasis on civil liberties.
I have to go take a final exam at a Community College. I have a B.S., but I continue to learn. You should try some additional formal education, I've found it to be a lifelong joy.
-Chuck, Vegetarian fanboy [/quot
Your use of the term, 'folks on you side' is completely inaccurate. I am as Far from a right wing lunatic as you can find. I think my principles are much more in line with libertarianism, or slightly right of center. I oppose censorship, think obscenity laws are ridiculous(but for now they are the law of the land), i think education is a fundamental right, and i believe in the rights to life liberty and the persuit of happiness. And just becasue somebody elses right to persue happiness pisses me off it doesnt dimish those rights of that individual. I thinks sex education and the governmets providing birth control is a good thing, i just dont think it should be MANDATORY as suggested by others.(and by withholding any aide to a country unless they control their population, you in effect make it mandatory) (kind of like that gag rule you talk about)
I think if you reread my posts very carefully you will see that i am not a right winger. Actually, what in any of my posts do you consider extreme right wing?
And my argument was never that Max's material SHOULD be illegal, I just pointed out that , as the laws are written, 12 average people found Max guilty of the law. I am all FOR changing those laws and I will use my power at the ballot box to do my part to change them. I think I have always maintained a consistant argument, wihtout resorting (too much) to the 'mostly' childish responses here.
p.s. And to try do discredit someon by applying the right wing label to them, well youre doing exactly what they do.Its a facist technique.(not that youre a facist, youre jusing one of the plays form their playbook, wheter you know it or not)
Edited by misterz (06/09/08 03:18 PM)
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#336230 - 06/09/08 03:21 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Quote:
On page 5 of this thread he writes...."I dont believe in providing food aid to countries that arent "controling their poplulation."
on page 6 he writes...."I think that if developing countries "controlled their population" they would get out of povery faster.
Now if you dont understand ...
I understand full well what he's saying. I also understand that he's not advocating a Chinese-Style one-child per couple policy. Rather, he's against government funding of the offspring. Big difference.
Perhaps you should take some remedial English classes.
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#336231 - 06/09/08 03:28 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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Actually, it's capitalism. You earn money, you survive. You don't, you perish. So the market decides, not the government.
I agee with most of what you say, but again your contradiction is just too big to ignore. Yousay.....'so the market decides, NOT the government......yet you advocate government populaiont control....
And of course, being the (insert your own adjective) you are, you still will not answer, What means should those governments use to Control the Population, and how does that reconcile with your other stated beliefes?
And where do you get off misrepresenting my opinion about providing welare, I have stated.... i believe we should end all foriegn aid. But good try anyway
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#336232 - 06/09/08 03:31 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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Quote:
Quote:
On page 5 of this thread he writes...."I dont believe in providing food aid to countries that arent "controling their poplulation."
on page 6 he writes...."I think that if developing countries "controlled their population" they would get out of povery faster.
Now if you dont understand ...
I understand full well what he's saying. I also understand that he's not advocating a Chinese-Style one-child per couple policy. Rather, he's against government funding of the offspring. Big difference.
Perhaps you should take some remedial English classes.
Im reading the same thing you are Jim and i dont see any of that here. He has never said what you say he did.
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#336233 - 06/09/08 03:34 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
On page 5 of this thread he writes...."I dont believe in providing food aid to countries that arent "controling their poplulation."
on page 6 he writes...."I think that if developing countries "controlled their population" they would get out of povery faster.
Now if you dont understand ...
I understand full well what he's saying. I also understand that he's not advocating a Chinese-Style one-child per couple policy. Rather, he's against government funding of the offspring. Big difference.
Perhaps you should take some remedial English classes.
Im reading the same thing you are Jim and i dont see any of that here. He has never said what you say he did. Hes talking about population to control to end povery. That is not simply saying, no government funding far far from it nice try though lets see what fatman has to say
nice try backpedalling for him
And SILL no one answers the dirct question I rest my case
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#336236 - 06/09/08 03:48 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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After all the backpedaling, name calling , and misrepresenting what I have written here, still not one person here has the COURAGE, not even our military hero, has the guts to answer, what means should these governments use to achieve the goal of population control? You want all of the freedoms that you believe you are entitled to but put conditions or prices on those same freedoms for every one else. How many ways can you say hypocrite? dodge, backpedal call names, and misrepresent, but god forbid answer one simple question. lol
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#336237 - 06/09/08 03:50 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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Quote:
Quote:
If the government didn't assist, we'd have a nation full of dummies.
We have that now. It's called no child left behind or as it actually works no child gets ahead.
+1 right on look at l.a. city schools,, where lefitist liberals have been incharge for 50 years. 55% drop out rate.
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#336240 - 06/09/08 04:54 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Quote:
Im reading the same thing you are Jim and i dont see any of that here. He has never said what you say he did.
Yeah, he did. HERE
Quote:
I'm not FORCING them to stop having kids. I'm just not going to pay for them. They can still "express themselves" and have as many as they want ... WITHOUT MY MONEY.
They can do what they want ...
I can do what I want ...
Perfect.
If you learned how to speak and read the English language, you might have caught it the first time. Asshole.
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#336241 - 06/09/08 07:24 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Gag Factor Guru
Porn Jesus
Registered: 07/15/05
Posts: 5290
Loc: Dayton
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Quote:
After all the backpedaling, name calling , and misrepresenting what I have written here, still not one person here has the COURAGE, not even our military hero, has the guts to answer, what means should these governments use to achieve the goal of population control? You want all of the freedoms that you believe you are entitled to but put conditions or prices on those same freedoms for every one else. How many ways can you say hypocrite? dodge, backpedal call names, and misrepresent, but god forbid answer one simple question. lol
All right, this is it.
I never said I was a "hero", far from it. You think it takes courage to make a political rant on a fuckin' porn forum? Jesus Horatio Fucking Christ on a Christmas tree.
I said quickly, before I went to ace my final, that education, availability of birth control, and counseling and classes for those with expanding families would be a good way to approach this. Lifting things in general, so people have the ability to support children, will help. There are a lot of traditional liberal approaches to help people have and support reasonable families. Children should be looked upon with great value as individuals. I do believe it is a basic human right to carry on with another generation, but not to have a huge family.
Catholics are a big part of this problem. In the Old Testament, it says, "Be fruitful and multiply." Well, yeah, in the beginning. Not past the sustainable limits of the earth, in an exponential manner. Hey, someone here said they were Catholic, didn't they? Well, I think abortion should be safe, legal, and rare. Birth control should be encouraged. Abstinence only education does not work. To establish missionary footholds in underdeveloped parts of the world, and deny people basic reproductive freedom and sanitation because of some ancient text, is, well, obscene.
I find it hard to quarrel with the Chinese. People were starving, something had to be done. The solution respects the right to bring about another generation, but addresses the terrible overpopulation problem. No one likes rationing of anything, but there are only so many resources to go around.
This world can support a lot more folks if more were vegetarian. That would sure help.
I don't think I have ever advocated taking away rights, absent abuse or crime. Don't try to call me a hypocrite, or say I want special treatment. I've worked my balls bloody to get what I have, and now I am going to enjoy it. I've answered your tangental questions, tried to make out your sorry excuse for language, and put up with all of this I care for. It ain't fun no more. I can use the double negative because I come from the city of Paul Lawrence Dunbar, the first African American poet laureate. He wrote in colloquialisms. Kinda like CAOH. That was genius. You are just pitiful.
Again, if you don't think what happened to Max is fucked up, you don't know your ass from a hole in the ground. I hope Eminence Front is right, and the appeals process goes well. He is probably also right that what will be tolerated will evolve, and the fight will go on. I stop at Gag Factor, but defend those who go further. At one time, rock and roll was obscene. Let's try to move forward, not go back to 1957.
You know what I find offensive? Violent commercials for movies, or WWE, between innings of my ball games. I'm tricked into seeing images that offend me. But, I have no desire to censor the movies themselves.
I go away now, in my motorhome, to enjoy a great summer hiking with my dog. Again, dirty movies - OK. Religious zealots making oppression, poverty and war - obscene. Conservative Catholics who can't spell or reason - dumbass assholes.
Happy trails,
-Chuck, Vegetarian fanboy
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#336242 - 06/12/08 03:54 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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I find it hard to quarrel with the Chinese. People were starving, something had to be done. The solution respects the right to bring about another generation, but addresses the terrible overpopulation problem. No one likes rationing of anything, but there are only so many resources to go around.
This world can support a lot more folks if more were vegetarian. That would sure help.
I don't think I have ever advocated taking away rights, absent abuse or crime.
As someone who comes from a family that is dedicated to protecting all rights through your service in the military (very applaudable) I find it very disheartening that you would find "no quarrel" with the chinese solution to overpoplulation.
You sates "SOMETHING' had to be done. What you fail to explain is exactly what that "SONMETHING" is. You say "their solution" doesnt take away rights. Lets examine what it is that you mean by "SOMETHING" and "THEIR SOLUTION"
1.If a woman has more than one baby, she is arrested, sentenced to up to five years in prison and is sterilized by a medical procedure, whether she wants it or not.
2. The father is imprisoned for up to five years, and for a second or third offense can be sentenced to life in prison.
3. A woman found to be pregnagnt with a second or third child also undergoes a MANDATORY abortion.
THIS IS WHAT YOU HAVE NO QUARRELL WITH. Government sterilization, and forced abortion. Not so pretty as just describing it as "sonmething" and "their solution." Kind of like Hitlers solution to that nasty Jew problem.
Now lets say in 50 years, or sooner, someone in the united states decides that "SOMETHING' must be done to control the population. Will you have 'no quarrell' with our government doing the same thing? Oh wait, you sasy "stay out of my bedroom." And youre not a hypocrit? LMAO
And as far as saying catholics are a big part of the overpopulation problem, I dont see many catholics in China Or India (the largest populations). Who do you blame for the overpopulation isn these countries. It existed long befor GWB became president, so he's out, theres no catholics or christions there (actually a very minute % of the population), so their out. The answer is poverty. Poverty causes overpoplulation, not the other way around. I know that is probably a difficult concept for you to accept, but it is true.
For the record, since I have now been labeled a right wing extremeist; As I have stated numerous times in this post and others in the past:
I believe ALL sex work should be legal.
I beleive the U.S. should end all foriegn aid.
I believe GWB is one of the worst presidents in recent times.
I believe the oil companies have more control over GWB than the religious right could ever dream of.
I believe VOTING is the ultimate form of free speech.
I do not share the church's stance on birth control, or our governments use of GAG rules in sex ed.
I beleive all obscenity laws, are themselves obscene.
If that makes me a right wing loony then so be it.
And Charin, that photo of the place with alot of holes in the ground, as you describe it, maybe on your headstone their they will write, "Here lies Charin, He has no problem with the Chinese government solution to overpopulation."
When they plant you in that hole take a look around, those next to you will be turning over in their graves.
Their solution doesnt look so pretty when you look at the details. Lets hope their is never a "need" for our government to control our population. I'm sure Charin and his ilk will have no problem enforcing their solution, after all as Charin states, "Something had to be done."
It seems to me that Charin is one of those who believes "the end justifies the means."
But Charin does have the solution, eat more celery.
ALL VEGANS ARE DANGEROUS!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Inmy poinion, your stance on this issue is OBSCENE.
And I'll ask again, how many cahtolics and christians are there in China and India? Kind of puts a little damper on that argument about catholics causing overpoplutation. But nice try.
And as far as your laughable statement about being TRICKED into watching violent and offensive commercial during your ballgame, what a load of hogwash. Just like you say about Max's material, IF YOU DONT LIKE IT, THEN TURN IT OFF. You know full well those commercials are out there when you turn your t.v. on. Do you like the viagra commercials during baseball games. I think thy're hilarious, but it sure is unconmfortable when your ten year old daughter is watching isnt it? Kind of a cath 22 dont ya think? Or would you favor the governmetn doing "something" about it?
I WAS TRICKED INTO WATCHING OFFENSIVE COMMERCIALS ON TELEVISION.......NOW I HAVE HEARD IT ALL.
And this leads me to the final statement of yours quoted above...... "I do not believe I have advocated taking away rights, absent abuse or crime." And this is exactly what the Chinese do. Thety make it illegal to have more children, therfore when they punish you for it they are not abusing any rights, after all, by having those children you committed a criminal act.
Which correlates very well with the original topic here. By making obscenity illegal the government can punish its producers without violating any RIGHTS because it was a criminal act. I guess its ok for the chinese to do this , according to you, but not for our government to do it to us.(for the recored, i believe NEITHER govt. should have that right)
But then again, if you cant afford your rights, you have no right to them, or so the logic goes according to others posting here. Freedom and personal choice are a double edged sword. But the problems freedom, and freedom of choice bring upon us, are miniscule compared to the "solutions' you and you ILK would have thrust upon us.
And can anyone quote anything I have ever written which would lead somebody to believe I am a right wign christiam conservative. I am catholic but I only go to church about once or twice a year, depending totally on the number of friends of mine who have either died or are getting maried.
Putting such labels on someone ino order to minimize the value of their opinion is actually a propoganda technique called 'transference." And yes, I am very good at, like MNAY here, using subtle propoganda techniques ike this. But I admit it. Will you?
Kind of like saying, "Iwas in the military, and so was all of my family"..... its a way of 'transferring" the honorable aspects of military service to the "opinion" youre representing. You try to transfer the honor and respect of the military to your opinion. It just doesnt jive. WE ALL USE PROPOGANDA, WE JUST DONT ALL ADMIT IT. At least i do.
Edited by misterz (06/12/08 05:52 PM)
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#336244 - 06/12/08 06:14 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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Quote:
Jesus fucking Christ, you are a windmill of sad.
Take your ritalin.
I'd rather take a bong hit. And, as a christian, I'm very sorry that expressing an opinion that differs from the majority here is seen as such a disservice to the board. Please forgive me. I cant live without your acceptance.
P.S. If you dont like it dont read it. Nobody is forcing you. Like it or not, I have the same rights as you. The only difference is,... I respect your rights and your opinions, and i encourage you to voice them, even if i disagree. Can you say the same?
Shall I get into the propoganda technique YOU just used regarding name calling.
Edited by misterz (06/12/08 06:16 PM)
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#336245 - 06/12/08 06:22 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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FATMAN WROTE;
No. You said we should pay for these foreigner to have as many kids as they want.
Sorry. You lose.
Please show me where I said anything that is even remotely close to that. ANYBODY.
And Fatman, that thing about the religious right somehow being responsible for you not being able to grow HEMP, that was really funny. Now quick, make a comment on my spelling, it will make you look more intelligent. (thats called sarcasm, it too is a propoganda technique.)
Edited by misterz (06/12/08 06:24 PM)
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#336246 - 06/12/08 06:27 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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Quote:
FATMAN WROTE;
No. You said we should pay for these foreigner to have as many kids as they want.
Sorry. You lose.
Please show me where I said anything that is even remotely close to that. ANYBODY.
And Fatman, that thing about the religious right somehow being responsible for you not being able to grow HEMP, that was really funny. Now quick, make a comment on my spelling, it will make you look more intelligent. (thats called sarcasm, it too is a propoganda technique.)
And if they are in their own country, they arent foreigners.
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#336248 - 06/12/08 06:45 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 01/25/06
Posts: 4470
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Quote:
After all the backpedaling, name calling , and misrepresenting what I have written here, still not one person here has the COURAGE, not even our military hero, has the guts to answer, what means should these governments use to achieve the goal of population control? You want all of the freedoms that you believe you are entitled to but put conditions or prices on those same freedoms for every one else. How many ways can you say hypocrite? dodge, backpedal call names, and misrepresent, but god forbid answer one simple question. lol
But you have an answer, and it's the correct one, right? That reeks alot like the 'president' of my union local, and he's a 'man of god'. Therefore, anything he does is of course, 'the right way'.
Alot of what's being misconstrued here is 'freedom of speech' -v- 'freedom to do whatever we please'.
So these poor, povety-stricken people, what are they doing with all these children? Eating them? No, they are using them for WELFARE. The welfare system needs to curl up & die somewhere, or at least be limited heavily.
_________________________
Because you already yelled 'dropping prices!!!' after Red Light canned you. - Gia Jordan to Brandon Iron
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#336249 - 06/12/08 07:00 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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Quote:
Quote:
After all the backpedaling, name calling , and misrepresenting what I have written here, still not one person here has the COURAGE, not even our military hero, has the guts to answer, what means should these governments use to achieve the goal of population control? You want all of the freedoms that you believe you are entitled to but put conditions or prices on those same freedoms for every one else. How many ways can you say hypocrite? dodge, backpedal call names, and misrepresent, but god forbid answer one simple question. lol
But you have an answer, and it's the correct one, right? That reeks alot like the 'president' of my union local, and he's a 'man of god'. Therefore, anything he does is of course, 'the right way'.
Alot of what's being misconstrued here is 'freedom of speech' -v- 'freedom to do whatever we please'.
Jack i agree, and also apologize for my name calling inearlier posts. There is a differnce betwen 'rights' and 'wants".
I have an opinion as to what I think is right. As do you and everyone else.
I'm not sure where this falls..I have th 'right' to watch max,,,,or i 'want' to watch max. I think it is a right. The overuse of propoganda on all sides only confuses the issue. Just like your unioun prez is "always right" because he is a man of god, is no more or no less insulting than ALL CHRISTIANS ARE DANGEROUS...implying that all of their opions are likewise dangerous. Its an argument for the weak, who cant justify their own opinions, so they ATTEMPT, to discredit with personal swipes the opinions thay cant refute with logic. (note my own use of sublte propoganda here, but also notice, I admit it)
Sounds like your union prez. is very good at the 'tranference' technique of propoganda.
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#336250 - 06/12/08 07:04 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 01/25/06
Posts: 4470
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Quote:
Sounds like your union prez. is very good at the 'tranference' technique of propoganda.
First of all, he's not really our 'prez' because he appointed himself to the position after no one voted anyone else in (proper ballots weren't handed out per union guidelines).
Secondly, he believe he's "right", because "the man above tells him so". So his authority is based on a fictional being telling him that the decisions he's making on behalf of the union are "OK".
I don't call it propoganda or transference, I call it delusional.
_________________________
Because you already yelled 'dropping prices!!!' after Red Light canned you. - Gia Jordan to Brandon Iron
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#336251 - 06/12/08 07:41 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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Quote:
Quote:
Sounds like your union prez. is very good at the 'tranference' technique of propoganda.
First of all, he's not really our 'prez' because he appointed himself to the position after no one voted anyone else in (proper ballots weren't handed out per union guidelines).
Secondly, he believe he's "right", because "the man above tells him so". So his authority is based on a fictional being telling him that the decisions he's making on behalf of the union are "OK".
I don't call it propoganda or transference, I call it delusional.
Now that kind of looks like youre doing the same thing he does. It looks to me like if someone doesnt agree with your opinion about religion they are dillusional. And actually what you just did right here is a picture perfect example of transference propoganda. At least i admit to using propoganda, while others here who do the same thing deny it even when it is pointed out to them with absolute clarity. Dillusional indeed. Call it what you want but, a rose by any other name is still a rose.
I just love to see everyone here get so upset when they get called on their bullshit, and cant, for the life of them, accept that their opinion isnt shared by everyone else. But when you are that close minded then its hard to see your own contradictions, and in my opinion, many people here are as close minded about their own opinions as they accuse the religious right of being about thier opinions. Thats why you call them dillusional, or say all christians are dangerous, or call names. To paraphrase a famous christian prayer, please forgive my tresspasses, as I forgive those who tresspass against me.....or perhaps i should use a more simple old saying for those here who cannot see past their own closed minded opinions(imho).......stciks and stones may break my bones, but douche-bags like you will never hurt me. (and for the record i use 4, count them4 differnt propoganda techniques in one post, which is actually far less than most of you use in your posts. But I have the guts to admit it.
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#336252 - 06/12/08 07:42 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Sounds like your union prez. is very good at the 'tranference' technique of propoganda.
First of all, he's not really our 'prez' because he appointed himself to the position after no one voted anyone else in (proper ballots weren't handed out per union guidelines).
Secondly, he believe he's "right", because "the man above tells him so". So his authority is based on a fictional being telling him that the decisions he's making on behalf of the union are "OK".
I don't call it propoganda or transference, I call it delusional.
Now that kind of looks like youre doing the same thing he does. It looks to me like if someone doesnt agree with your opinion about religion they are dillusional. And actually what you just did right here is a picture perfect example of transference propoganda. At least i admit to using propoganda, while others here who do the same thing deny it even when it is pointed out to them with absolute clarity. Dillusional indeed. Call it what you want but, a rose by any other name is still a rose. Just because you dont call it propoganda doesnt mean it isnt, in my opinion.
I just love to see everyone here get so upset when they get called on their bullshit, and cant, for the life of them, accept that their opinion isnt shared by everyone else. But when you are that close minded then its hard to see your own contradictions, and in my opinion, many people here are as close minded about their own opinions as they accuse the religious right of being about thier opinions. Thats why you call them dillusional, or say all christians are dangerous, or call names. To paraphrase a famous christian prayer, please forgive my tresspasses, as I forgive those who tresspass against me.....or perhaps i should use a more simple old saying for those here who cannot see past their own closed minded opinions(imho).......stciks and stones may break my bones, but douche-bags like you will never hurt me. (and for the record i use 4, count them4 differnt propoganda techniques in one post, which is actually far less than most of you use in your posts. But I have the guts to admit it.
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#336253 - 06/12/08 07:44 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Will you please stop quoting half-a-page of text and not responding to it. Especially when its the post you just made?
Thank you.
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#336255 - 06/12/08 08:15 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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Quote:
Will you please stop quoting half-a-page of text and not responding to it. Especially when its the post you just made?
Thank you.
Since you asked so politely, yes.
edited for dyslexia
Edited by misterz (06/12/08 08:19 PM)
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#336256 - 06/12/08 08:18 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Rob Black's Crack Pipe
Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 108
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Quote:
I think you meant to tell him to shut the fuck up.
And since youre such a cocksucking faggot, you can kiss my god fearing ass.
see, i'm really no better than you . maybe thats what
scares ya. but i'll admit it.
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#336258 - 06/14/08 06:26 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 01/25/06
Posts: 4470
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Quote:
Now that kind of looks like youre doing the same thing he does. It looks to me like if someone doesnt agree with your opinion about religion they are dillusional.
You seriously are a dumb fuck.
If everything he does is 'right' in his own life, that's fine. But the decisions he makes representing us as a whole are indeed delusional. He's ONLY entitled to practice them in his own home.
You don't admit to shit bub, it just falls in your lap like the whore at the last titty bar you may have visited. The 'propaganda' crap you're discussing is just an excuse to give you the faux vision that you yourself are correct.
You obviously missed the point, carry on with your retarded ramblings now.
Meh.
_________________________
Because you already yelled 'dropping prices!!!' after Red Light canned you. - Gia Jordan to Brandon Iron
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#336259 - 06/16/08 08:33 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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AC Cream Wannabe
Registered: 01/16/06
Posts: 467
Loc: Yankee Stadium
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#336261 - 06/18/08 10:26 AM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Porn Fucking Master
Registered: 05/18/06
Posts: 3555
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too bad max won't get a shot to piss on r. kelly in prison. although r. kelly would prob. like it.
_________________________
"I'm going to spend the rest of the weekend deep frying the fuck out of anything that gets in my way."
--Handful
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#336262 - 06/18/08 12:49 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 09/23/04
Posts: 10321
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I'm betting Max will be treated as a hero in prison.
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#336263 - 06/18/08 01:09 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Quote:
I'm betting Max will be treated as a hero in prison.
I agree. Assuming he goes to prison at all. Given the controversial nature of his "offense," he just might be allowed out on bail pending appeal.
Even if he does go, it's not like they're going to put him in the supermax facility in Florence. He'll end up on Terminal Island or in Lompoc.
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#336264 - 06/18/08 09:22 PM
Re: Trial Update: Max Found Guilty on 10 Counts
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Quote:
I'm betting Max will be treated as a hero in prison.
Club fed will be nice to max....he will be asked for autographs...just like mike tyson....but like jim said....min to med security....someplace G. Gordon Liddy graduated from.
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