The Connecticut Shooting thread has turned into a gun control thing. I'm usually up for a good thread derailment, but over the backdrop of those dead people is a little too skeevy for my taste.

fire that message off to barry0 will ya?.

He's such a lightweight.

fuck gun control

I'm not in love with the NRA ad. Sausage and Bulimia are targets and should have protection. It comes with their dad's job, as it should.

Obama, Cuomo and Bloomberg are the new 3 Stooges or is that the new Hitler, Mussolini and Tojo ? I gave Obama the benefit of the doubt for a long time. No more. He's evil ! Plain and simple.

I'm not in love with the NRA ad. Sausage and Bulimia are targets and should have protection. It comes with their dad's job, as it should.

Burroughs was a trust-fund kid who got hooked on junk, shot his wife, fucked kids in Morocco and joined Scientology. Love his books but not exactly someone to take life lessons from.

Obama, Cuomo and Bloomberg are the new 3 Stooges or is that the new Hitler, Mussolini and Tojo ?

smutpov probably learned about Burroughs from Kurt Cobain or the Just One Fix video.

Have you read a word he wrote? Naked Lunch and Junkie aren't generally stocked in the walmart book rack next to harry potter and 50 shades of grey.

I believe when the 11 armed guards are mentioned about the school they go to, it's not counting the Secret Service.

Only a Nirvana or Ministry fan would say that.




Hey fuckface, Yeah, I've read a few of his books, but overall, Burroughs was too queer for me. Probably not you.
I wouldn't shop at Wal-Mart if my life depended on it, though you must shop there like white trash if you know what books they sell. Who'd have guessed a self loathing misanthrope like yourself who listens to shitty black metal would be defending the status quo unless you're just overplaying your online schtick like you usually do. Stupid is as stupid does I guess.

There's the rub. I'm sure the guards beyond the SS are a selling point to prospective customers, er, students. Even with all that, a maniac on a suicide mission and some planning could still do a fuckton of damage.

If we're seriously talking about really protecting schools, we need to look at jail/ prison level security. Walls, razor wire, armed guards (plural), sally- ports for dropping off and picking up. The "visitor" sticker I had to wear the other day (that I didn't have to wear 6 weeks ago) will stop no one with bad intentions.

It was Leftist do- gooders that emptied the mental institutions in the 70s and made it near impossible to commit someone against their will. Short memories, we have.

I prefer the term "black gun" to "assault weapon". The local paper did a little dialog box of gun definitions a week or so ago...well...their definitions. Basically, an assault weapon can fire one bullet or more with one press of the trigger. An automatic is the same as a semi- automatic...both fire one bullet then with each trigger pull and reload automatically. I love it when people who know nothing about the subject feel they need to mold opinion.

It all depends on who's pulling the trigger. I'm a terrible long range shooter. I'd be worthless in a clocktower.

Many politicians and high powered executives send their kids to schools with guards. It isn't to protect from random loons, it is to protect from kidnapping for ransom. I know people that went to school in unmarked, blacked out vans w/ guards, and that was in the 80's.

“Today The Journal News has removed the permit data from lohud.com. Our decision to do so is not a concession to critics that no value was served by the posting of the map in the first place,” Journal News publisher Janet Hasson explained. “On the contrary, we’ve heard from too many grateful community members to consider our decision to post information contained in the public record to have been a mistake. Nor is our decision made because we were intimidated by those who threatened the safety of our staffers. We know our business is a controversial one, and we do not cower.”

Because handgun permit information is now classified as private information, not subject to Freedom of Information Law requests, Ms. Hasson said that the map simply lost value to the newspaper’s readers.

“But the database has been public for 27 days and we believe those who wanted to view it have done so already,” she continued. “As well, with the passage of time, the data will become outdated and inaccurate….[W]e will keep a snapshot of our map–with all its red dots– on our website to remind the community that guns are a fact of life we should never forget.

Institutionalizing people against their will is a whole other ball of slippery slope wax argument that I don't really want to get into right now.. I would assume you wouldn't want the evil gubmint decided who they deem mentally unfit, why, nancy pelosi might just decided to throw god fearing good christians in nut houses for voting against obama!....I'm much more concerned with the gigantic lack of mental health care in this country, maybe if we had socizilized medicine schizoprenics could get the meds they need cheaply but there's really no profit in helping wackjobs....a swiss pall of mine made the point that they have just as many guns in their country but people don't wake up paranoid everyday that they are going to be homeless next month digging in the garbage for something to eat and maybe that has something to do with the way things work in america. The sniper comment was more a reference to the rightwings fetishistic obsession with military might/ the stoic solider, when it's the same system that creates people like Charles Whitman long before Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold where an itch in their daddies ball bags.

Vice President Joseph R. Biden’s claim that he heard the gunshots of a 2006 school massacre while playing golf is raising questions about his veracity or his memory.

Mr. Biden told a meeting of mayors in Washington Thursday that he was about a quarter-mile away from an Amish schoolhouse on Oct. 2, 2006, when a gunman shot and killed five students and wounded five others.

“I happened to be literally — probably, it turned out, to be a quarter of a mile [away] at an outing when I heard gunshots in the woods,” Mr. Biden recounted. “We didn’t know … we thought they were hunters.”

But a search of maps of the area in Lancaster County, Pa., shows the nearest golf course to the site of the shooting, Moccasin Run Golf Club, is about five miles away. Rodney King, the golf pro at Moccasin Run, said Friday he was working at the course on the day of the shooting and never saw Mr. Biden, who was then a U.S. senator.

“There’s a lot of things here that I find hard to believe,” Mr. King said. “I looked in my database, and he [Mr. Biden] is not in my database.”

Even if Mr. Biden had played at the course that day, Mr. King said, “It’s very far-fetched that he would have heard it.”

“I know he didn’t hear those gunshots,” Mr. King said. “They were inside the school. Even if they were outside, he wouldn’t have heard them.”

A spokeswoman for the vice president did not return a request seeking comment Friday. Mr. Biden told the story as he was describing for the mayors’ group the Obama administration’s efforts to enact new gun-control laws.

Another golf course in the region, the Lancaster Country Club, is about 10 miles away from the site of the shooting. Mr. King said it’s more likely that a group of golfers including a senator would play there.

“I would be honored to have Joe Biden play here because he’s a public figure,” he said. “But I put myself in his shoes — Moccasin Run Golf Club would not be the golf course I would go to if I’m going on a golf trip. We are a public facility.”

Mr. Biden said after the shooting, he saw helicopters flying to the scene. Medical helicopters were used to transport victims on that day.

Mr. King said there is a sportsman’s club about a mile from his golf course, and golfers can hear the shots from time to time during target practice. The schoolhouse has since been razed.

While running for the Democratic presidential nomination in 2007, Mr. Biden said in a debate that he had been “shot at” during a trip to Iraq. Pressed by reporters, he eventually described three incidents on two separate Iraq trips in which he felt that he was shot at or might have been shot at.

He ended up revising his description by saying: “I was near where a shot landed.”

Aides later said that on one occasion Mr. Biden heard mortars being fired a few hundreds yards away from the building where he was staying in the Green Zone, and on another occasion a bullet was fired at a helicopter in which he was flying.

Read more: http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013.../#ixzz2IS1cc6Ry

Institutionalizing people against their will is a whole other ball of slippery slope wax...

The bigger picture, at least for me, is how the mentally ill are treated in general. Beyond whackjobs shooting up schools. The way we allow the damaged around us suffer needlessly is a fucking crime. Especially in a society that deep down knows better.

You'd be singing a different tune if it was black dudes doing the shooting.


White people can be crazy as fuck and no one will ever think ..."Maybe it's something about the white mind?" Brothers fuck up and suddenly its due to our innate violent nature.

You'd be singing a different tune if it was black dudes doing the shooting.

White people can be crazy as fuck and no one will ever think ..."Maybe it's something about the white mind?" Brothers fuck up and suddenly its due to our innate violent nature.

You just answered your own question J.B.

Exactly, which is why your post is bullshit. There is no fundamental difference between them.

You'd be singing a different tune if it was black dudes doing the shooting.

White people can be crazy as fuck and no one will ever think ..."Maybe it's something about the white mind?" Brothers fuck up and suddenly its due to our innate violent nature.

I disagree on the Whitman thing. I don't know the exact details, but he did have a sizable brain tumor in an area that controls not whacking the family and bystanders. Neither of us, or anyone, really knows tho.

I will say that your thing about being worried about their next paycheck didn't seem to be a concern for the mass shooters of the last several years. Lanza's job was being nuts. Same with the Colorado shooter, altho I think he may have had a real job of some sort. Kleobold, Harris, the VT shooter were all students, altho I think Kliebold and Harris (or maybe just one of them...I honestly don't remember) had typical high school kid jobs. The guy who shot up the Amish school was an electrician...or something like that. The kids in Oregon and Arkansas that shot up their schools were all students. Going further back to when Post Office shooters were the big rage, all the ones who went postal worked for the Post Office. Government gig, impossible to get fired from. Not a comprehensive list, by any means, but more comprehensive than just throwing out fear of losing a job setting people on suicide missions.

I think suggesting that Pelosi will have people committed because they didn't vote for Obama brings nothing to the discussion. I do find it interesting that you assume the Fed should/ would be in charge of deciding who gets committed and who doesn't. It's very slippery slope when a crat 3000 miles away makes decisions like that. But that isn't how it was in the 50s and 60s. It was done at a local level. Make no mistake, I have no illusion that deciding someone needs to be committed is anything other than grim business. It should be grim. It's a really huge decision and should be taken seriously. I don't trust the Federal gov with that role, but I do trust the local health authorities, who live here, to it. At least to a point.

I understand that forcibly committing people might not be a subject you want to "talk about right now", but I'm not sure we have that luxury. Putting our heads in the sand over the details is what has led us to this point.

I'm with you about the mental health system being inadequate. The problem is that being schizophrenic isn't the same as having a cyst. It takes more than easier access to meds to treat someone with schizophrenia, or any other mental illness. Easier access to meds doesn't mean that people will take them. Through our jobs my girl and I both come into contact with a lot of mentally ill people. When they decide to take themselves off their meds, and they do, it's a pretty hard thing to watch.

As for socialized medicine across the board as a fix for the mental health system, is that really going to be effective? Punish everyone for the inadequacies of a small part of the health care system? Maybe it would be easier to improve the mental health system first rather than throwing the baby out with the bathwater. Make it easier to qualify for disability because of mental illness. Let the protections, such as easier access to treatment, of a disability qualification kick in.

The bigger picture, at least for me, is how the mentally ill are treated in general. Beyond whackjobs shooting up schools. The way we allow the damaged around us suffer needlessly is a fucking crime. Especially in a society that deep down knows better.

Right. But tell that to LaPierre. That's another part of the problem, this insane "no prisoners" approach on both sides: With proper background checks, we should be able to expand the number of people who can safely, legally carry. Problem is, the background checks will piss off the NRA and the expanded number of permits will piss off the other side.

You gotta be a fucking asshole to own goats.

Have you read a word he wrote? Naked Lunch and Junkie aren't generally stocked in the walmart book rack next to harry potter and 50 shades of grey.

There are two problems with a universal background check requirement.

The first is that background checks cost money and require some infrastructure that private sellers are unlikely to have. Most private sales are one guy selling a used gun to another. Are they supposed to go to the police station for that?

The second is that background checks establish the framework of an infrastructure to register all gun ownership, which in turn presents the possibility of later confiscation. Do you really want the government to know where every gun is?

By the way, if you think the government ought to be taking action on those background checks, perhaps by arresting and prosecuting those who are caught lying on the forms, your Vice President has already dismissed that idea, saying "We haven't got time for that!" What's the point of all these background checks you want, then?

Seems to me that the objective is merely to harass and burden those of us who would pass the checks anyway.

The Connecticut Shooting thread has turned into a gun control thing. I'm usually up for a good thread derailment, but over the backdrop of those dead people is a little too skeevy for my taste.

I'm respectfully asking the group to not post Gun Control stuff, and the venom that comes with it, on the Conn. Shooting thread and to post it here.

I get that what happened in Conn. has been the catalyst for the new "debate", but I just think that we're talking two different stories at this point.

Do you really want the government to know where every gun is?

That is real gun control. The kind of gun control our Constitution demands.

Nah, that's what misguided gun control advocates demand. It's the "militia" that the 2nd Amendment says should be "well-regulated," which is then followed by the caveat "the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed." Militias were formed by ordinary people who joined together to bear arms against the tyranny of the British Empire.

Gun control = infringement.

A well regulated militia made up of mentally unstable blind quadriplegics with dementia perhaps?

While we're at it, let's burst this gun nut wacko fantasy that militias during the time of our forefathers where just a bunch of guys who decided they had a few hours before the next TV show came on and so they wandered out of the bar, grabbed their gun, shot at a few redcoats, and then went back home and got in bed. Like they accepted anybody who had an hour to spare, some extra ammo, a gun, and they got to have fun camping out in the woods and go home when they got homesick and nobody cared how well they could shoot.

What does blow my mind is the ease of which people seem to want to give up so much and allow government control and intrusion into our lives so insidiously. Guess there's no point arguing about that either.

You really don't believe that there are tons of guys who fantasize about using their guns to shoot Obama's evil government who couldn't last 2 hours in a real militia and have an unrealistic fantasy about what it would be like?

OK, what the hell, let's actually discuss gun control.

Since the second amendment expressly stresses the importance and role of regulation as the pre-requisite to gun ownership, shouldn't the laws be tougher?

I'm thinking along the lines of having to prove your competence and ability after you prove your suitability (i.e. mental health, criminal record, etc).

I don't think the type of gun or size of the ammo clip should be the issue, rather it should be about the ability of the individual (and prospective future militia member). I don't think any wack job should be allowed to be able to carry a deadly weapon. Nor should an elderly person with dementia who can't recognize family members from strangers. Nor should a person with Parkinson's Disease be allowed to own a gun unless they can hit the bulls eye and not the bystanders. Not only that, let's take it a step further. I think people should be required to show competence not just a driver's license. Even if a person is intelligent, mentally and physically sound, has no criminal record, is a pillar of the community, a nice guy, and a life time member of the NRA, they should be denied the ability to own a gun if they can't demonstrate good gun safety and the ability to shoot competently.

I would also propose making classifications of weapon types and giving certifications for the ability to own those weapon types.

That is real gun control. The kind of gun control our Constitution demands.

You really don't believe that there are tons of guys who fantasize about using their guns to shoot Obama's evil government who couldn't last 2 hours in a real militia and have an unrealistic fantasy about what it would be like?