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#408150 - 03/18/09 11:37 AM
Britain apologises for 'Third World' hospital
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 08/09/06
Posts: 9113
Loc: red dirt state of mind
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Quote:
The British government apologised Wednesday after a damning official report into a hospital likened by one patient's relative to "a Third World" health centre.
Stafford Hospital in central England was found to have appalling standards of care, putting patients at risk and leading to some dying, according to a report on Tuesday.
Between 400 and 1,200 more people died than would have been expected in a three-year period at the National Health Service (NHS) hospital, according to an investigation by the Healthcare Commission watchdog.
"We do apologise to all those people who have suffered from the mistakes that have been made in the Stafford Hospital," said Prime Minister Gordon Brown, questioned on the matter at his weekly grilling in the House of Commons.
Receptionists with no medical training were left to to assess patients arriving at the hospital's accident and emergency department, the report found.
Julie Bailey, whose 86-year-old mother Bella died in the hospital in November 2007, said she and other family members slept in a chair at her bedside for eight weeks because they were so concerned about poor care.
"What we saw in those eight weeks will haunt us for the rest of our lives," said the 47-year-old. "We saw patients drinking out of flower vases they were so thirsty.
"There were patients wandering around the hospital and patients fighting. It was continuous through the night. Patients were screaming out in pain because you just could not get pain relief.
"It was like a Third World country hospital. It was an absolute disgrace."
The British premier, who has trumpeted huge increases in spending on the NHS since his Labour party took office in 1997, said there were "no excuses" for what happened to patients at the hospital.
Health Secretary Alan Johnson said: "I apologise on behalf of the government and the NHS, for the pain and anguish caused to so many patients and their families by the appalling standards of care at Stafford Hospital.
"Patients will want to be absolutely certain that the quality of care at Stafford Hospital has been radically transformed, and in particular, that the urgent and emergency care is administered safely," he added.
Hey, where can we Americans sign up for one of these super duper national health care systems like the UK has?
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#408151 - 03/18/09 12:15 PM
Re: Britain apologises for 'Third World' hospital
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Kurt Lackwood's Fluffer
Registered: 01/18/06
Posts: 1283
Loc: SoCal
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And what we have is SO much better? King/Drew fucking changed it's name to King/Harbor to distance itself from it's sordid past. Just look at it's history: http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-kingdrew-galleryHere's just a few easily verifiable facts about our WONDERFUL profit-driven healthcare system: The United States is the only industrialized country in the world without a universal health insurance system. In 2006, the U.S. census reported that 46 million Americans (recently revised downward to 45 million) have no health insurance. Over a third (36%) of families living below the poverty line are uninsured. Hispanic Americans (34%) are more than twice as likely to be uninsured as white Americans, (13%) while 21% of black Americans have no health insurance. More than 9 million children lack health insurance in America. Eighteen thousand people die each year because they are uninsured. According to the UN Human Development Report, “The uninsured are less likely to have regular outpatient care, so they are more likely to be hospitalized for avoidable health problems. Once in hospital, they receive fewer services and are more likely to die in the hospital than are insured patients. They also receive less preventive care. Over 40% of the uninsured do not have a regular place to go when they are sick and over a third of the uninsured say that they or someone in their family went without needed care, including recommended treatments or prescription drugs in the last year, because of cost.” Half of all bankruptcies are caused by medical bills. Three-quarters of those filings are people with health insurance.U.S. health care spending is approximately $2 trillion per year, or $6,697 per person. The United States continues to spend significantly more on health care than other countries in the world.Administrative costs account for 31 percent of all health care expenditures in the United States. The average overhead for U.S. private health insurers is 11.7 percent; for Medicare, it is 3.6 percent; for Canada’s national health insurance program, it is 1.3 percent. According to the UN Human Development Report, while the United States leads the world in spending on health care, “countries spending substantially less than the US have healthier populations. The infant mortality rate for the U.S. is now higher than for many other industrial countries.” A baby born in El Salvador has a better chance of surviving than a baby in Detroit. The infant mortality rate in Detroit is 15.5, compared to El Salvador's rate of 9.7. Canadians live three years longer on average than Americans do. A study in the Journal of the American Medical Association found that older Americans are significantly less healthy than their British counterparts - we have more diabetes, heart attacks, strokes, lung disease and cancer. Even the poorest Brits can expect to live longer than the richest Americans. Cubans have a lower infant mortality rate than the United States and according to the U.N. Human Development Report, a longer average lifespan. Over the next decade, the federal government will give the drug and health care industries an estimated $822 billion as a result of the 2003 enactment of Medicare Part D (the Medicare prescription drug plan). There are four times as many health care lobbyists in Washington as there are members of Congress. Ninety percent of Americans believe the American health care system needs fundamental changes or needs to be completely rebuilt. Two-thirds of Americans believe the federal government should guarantee universal health care for all citizens. Another good article on our broken healthcare system: http://www.prospect.org/cs/articles?article=ten_reasons_why_american_health_care_is_so_badI think you'll find it's a lot harder to find something "Good" about our current system then it is to find something "Bad" about other systems.
_________________________
I'd rather be ignorant than stupid.
Ignorance implies a lack of knowledge which is easily correctable through education.
Stupidity implies an inability to learn.
Therefore; ignorance is temporary, stupidity is forever!
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#408152 - 03/18/09 12:19 PM
Re: Britain apologises for 'Third World' hospital
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 08/09/06
Posts: 9113
Loc: red dirt state of mind
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and just why does our health care system cost so much? Can you even fathom the reasons?
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#408153 - 03/18/09 12:32 PM
Re: Britain apologises for 'Third World' hospital
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Kurt Lackwood's Fluffer
Registered: 01/18/06
Posts: 1283
Loc: SoCal
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Because it is a profit-driven system. It has very little to do with the health of the individual and almost everything to do with how much money can be made off of the individual.
When health care choices are made based on the "profit margin" there is no room left for the Hippocratic Oath.
_________________________
I'd rather be ignorant than stupid.
Ignorance implies a lack of knowledge which is easily correctable through education.
Stupidity implies an inability to learn.
Therefore; ignorance is temporary, stupidity is forever!
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#408154 - 03/18/09 12:37 PM
Re: Britain apologises for 'Third World' hospital
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 09/07/05
Posts: 14160
Loc: NYC
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it has a lot to do with the health of the individual. otherwise, they wouldn't need so much medical care.
_________________________
"What I do know is that if Karen Carpenter and Mama Cass Elliot had shared that sandwich they'd both be alive today." -Michael K
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#408155 - 03/18/09 12:37 PM
Re: Britain apologises for 'Third World' hospital
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 08/09/06
Posts: 9113
Loc: red dirt state of mind
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Quote:
Because it is a profit-driven system. It has very little to do with the health of the individual and almost everything to do with how much money can be made off of the individual.
When health care choices are made based on the "profit margin" there is no room left for the Hippocratic Oath.
Fail.
It's the cost of malpractice insurance.Typical liberal, wants to spend 10 times as much to completely overhaul something, when the best first step would be to remove/lessen the parasites. Funny how our new fearless leader is a lawyer himself. Things that make you go hmmmm.
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#408156 - 03/18/09 12:40 PM
Re: Britain apologises for 'Third World' hospital
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 09/07/05
Posts: 14160
Loc: NYC
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omg. thank you. i was just about to say i blame the poors and government handouts, but i didn't want to sound snotty. we have an overpopulation problem and what demographic keeps getting bigger and bigger...the poors. who is most likely to have a shitty diet because they don't have enough resources to properly feed and nurture their family they couldn't afford to have (or beyond one child) in the first place...yep, same people.
i'd like to see the gov reward successful people instead of leeches.
_________________________
"What I do know is that if Karen Carpenter and Mama Cass Elliot had shared that sandwich they'd both be alive today." -Michael K
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#408157 - 03/18/09 12:47 PM
Re: Britain apologises for 'Third World' hospital
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Gag Factor Guru
Porn Jesus
Registered: 07/15/05
Posts: 5290
Loc: Dayton
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Quote:
omg. thank you. i was just about to say i blame the poors and government handouts, but i didn't want to sound snotty. we have an overpopulation problem and what demographic keeps getting bigger and bigger...the poors. who is most likely to have a shitty diet because they don't have enough resources to properly feed and nurture their family they couldn't afford to have (or beyond one child) in the first place...yep, same people.
i'd like to see the gov reward successful people instead of leeches.
Wow. Just, wow.
the poors
-Chuck, Vegetarian fanboy
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#408159 - 03/18/09 12:49 PM
Re: Britain apologises for 'Third World' hospital
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 11/27/07
Posts: 4795
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I made 2 trips to the ER and had 1 minor surgery in '08 which would have destroyed me financially if I still lived in the US.
The main reason I moved back to Canada after school was for the health care. It's nice not being afraid to seek medical attention.
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#408160 - 03/18/09 12:53 PM
Re: Britain apologises for 'Third World' hospital
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 08/09/06
Posts: 9113
Loc: red dirt state of mind
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problem is, universal health care doesn't mean run by the government. haven't any of you had to go to the DMV, do you really want that level of service from a health care provider?
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#408164 - 03/18/09 01:06 PM
Re: Britain apologises for 'Third World' hospital
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 11/27/07
Posts: 4795
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I want to point out something else about the Canadian system.
As far as I know (please correct me if you know otherwise) the doctors here get paid on the basis of how many patients they see. So every time I visit a walk-in clinic and they swipe my card the doctor earns some dough.
Some times I have gotten the feeling that they are just hustling patients in and out so they can get as many card swipes as possible.
I've not had this issue since finding a "family doctor" or GP who was willing to see me regularly but some people don't seem to be able to find a regular doctor and care really does suffer when your doctor is a random walk-in clinic which never gets to know you.
Did that make sense? I'm tired, I apologize.
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#408165 - 03/18/09 01:10 PM
Re: Britain apologises for 'Third World' hospital
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Gag Factor Guru
Porn Jesus
Registered: 07/15/05
Posts: 5290
Loc: Dayton
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Quote:
Quote:
Or are you saying that the lack of universal healthcare for all Americans has lead to us being a more unhealthy nation?
all i heard was 'blah, blah, blah i blame the government for not providing for me.' how about personal responsibility? do you need the government to tell you to eat a banana instead of a pop tart?
Yeah, go bananas!
    
-Chuck, Vegetarian fanboy
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#408167 - 03/18/09 01:18 PM
Re: Britain apologises for 'Third World' hospital
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Gag Factor Guru
Porn Jesus
Registered: 07/15/05
Posts: 5290
Loc: Dayton
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Quote:
do you need the government to tell you to eat a banana instead of a pop tart?
Yes. I think we both agree allowing public schools to get money for putting soda and junk food machines in is counter productive. Maybe a bit of a carrot for schools with carrots? Combatting child obesity early by teaching health and nutrition?
-Chuck, Vegetarian fanboy
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#408168 - 03/18/09 01:18 PM
Re: Britain apologises for 'Third World' hospital
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 11/27/07
Posts: 4795
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Seriously. In one of my ER trips I had a CT scan and 2 ultra sounds.
If that had happened back in PA I would have been out many thousands of dollars just to be told that my appendix was okay and that I just was suffering from a really brutal flu.
I just wish I didn't look like such a dope on my Health Card picture.
_________________________
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#408169 - 03/18/09 01:19 PM
Re: Britain apologises for 'Third World' hospital
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 08/09/06
Posts: 9113
Loc: red dirt state of mind
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Quote:
That falls under the obscenely high Administrative costs I pointed out in my first post.
Now can you tell me why Malpractice Insurance has gone through the roof?
No it doesn't fall under that. You're like every liberal with their tongues up the trial lawyers asses. It's gone through the roof because we have a whole industry of lawyers that feast on it like vultures on a water buffalo carcass. Put limits on awards and watch the costs plummet. Believe it.
Quote:
Could it be because incompetent doctors are shuffled around and allowed to continue practicing (see link to King/Drew in my first post).
How is this going to change? The gov't and unions do the same things with teachers. Yeah gov't run is sooooo much better.
Quote:
Could it be because people are allowed to get worse or die because it's just too expensive to give them the proper treatment to get them well.
No, it's because there is a glut of humanity that chokes the nations ER's. Erect free minor emergency clinics. You don't need to spend trillions to ensure good health care for all.
Quote:
Could it be because a doctor in this country only spends an average of less than 5 minutes per patient so he can get the maximum insurance payouts per day instead of actually taking the time to find out what is wrong.
Does the doctor need more than 5 minutes in most cases? What are you a doctor too? Wait I don't want to hear anymore lies.
Quote:
Again, please point out the POSITIVE aspects of our current healthcare system, I think you'll be hard pressed to find any.
I don't have to wait in line like at the DMV. I don't have to increase the amount of tax I have to pay out exponentially.
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#408174 - 03/18/09 01:25 PM
Re: Britain apologises for 'Third World' hospital
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Gag Factor Guru
Porn Jesus
Registered: 07/15/05
Posts: 5290
Loc: Dayton
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And here in the U.S., I'm on triple bonus time - alcoholism, heart attack, and cancer. I got excellent care, and shitty administrative support. They got the important parts right. And I work for a company with good benefits.
Yes, for those who can afford it or have good insurance, we have a great system. Let's not throw out the baby with the bathwater. This is why Obama is open to ideas. He does not want the government to take over, he wants everyone to be covered.
Had I not been under good coverage, I might not have gotten sober, received the post-heart attack care I did to prevent additional problems, and my cancer would not have been discovered until I need treatments several times the cost. Good coverage was cheaper, long run, than none or shitty coverage.
-Chuck, Vegetarian fanboy
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#408177 - 03/18/09 01:31 PM
Re: Britain apologises for 'Third World' hospital
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 08/09/06
Posts: 9113
Loc: red dirt state of mind
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Quote:
Glad to see you're finally on-board with the idea of a national healthcare system.
No, I'm not. A brunch of free minor emergency clinics is not a national health care system. And I sure wouldn't want the gov't to run it. You're advocating a complete overhaul and nationalization. Unnecessary. We can erect these things at a minimum of cost if you just remove the parasites.
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#408178 - 03/18/09 01:34 PM
Re: Britain apologises for 'Third World' hospital
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 11/27/07
Posts: 4795
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Another Canadian thing, I'll stop after this.
In order for me to get health care in Ontario I must prove that I live here at least 6 months of the year. And my Ontario health coverage would not do me any good if I was traveling in Alberta and fell ill.
It's not so much national here as provincial.
What if each state set up their own system? Just food for thought, i haven't got an answer.
_________________________
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#408179 - 03/18/09 01:37 PM
Re: Britain apologises for 'Third World' hospital
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Porn Fucking Master
Registered: 02/23/05
Posts: 3724
Loc: Paddling my canoe in the wild
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Quote:
It's the cost of malpractice insurance.Typical liberal, wants to spend 10 times as much to completely overhaul something, when the best first step would be to remove/lessen the parasites.
Negligence laws (and the lawsuits they stem from) serve to reduce the number of fuck ups and to protect consumers from lazy careless people. Fear of lawsuits make people more careful. That said, in most cases punitive damage rewards are just retarded.
Quote:
Funny how our new fearless leader is a lawyer himself. Things that make you go hmmmm.
Speaking of retarded ... lawyers form the plurality (if not majority) of lawmakers for a number of reasons, including they are educated, tend to speak well, can understand complex issues and are well connected to their local business people for grass roots fundraising. To suggest there is a conspiracy to keep lawyers in positions of power is, well, retarded.
Quote:
Could it be because a doctor in this country only spends an average of less than 5 minutes per patient so he can get the maximum insurance payouts per day instead of actually taking the time to find out what is wrong.
The same criticism is leveled at Canadian doctors who need to see a certain number of patients a day to maximize their income (note - there is a 'top out' number which is based on a number of factors).
Quote:
Again, please point out the POSITIVE aspects of our current healthcare system, I think you'll be hard pressed to find any.
In comparison to the Canadian system, the US is far ahead in research and development (including pharma) and US hospitals are generally much better equipped technologically. All of this is a by-product of the profit based system. A hospital is more likely to purchase a second MRI machine when it can become a profit center for the hospital, for example.
In contrast, a typical Canadian patient may have to wait weeks for a spot in the MRI machine to assist in a diagnosis.
_________________________
You're all still alive?
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#408180 - 03/18/09 01:39 PM
Re: Britain apologises for 'Third World' hospital
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Gag Factor Guru
Porn Jesus
Registered: 07/15/05
Posts: 5290
Loc: Dayton
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Quote:
Quote:
That falls under the obscenely high Administrative costs I pointed out in my first post.
Now can you tell me why Malpractice Insurance has gone through the roof?
Could it be because incompetent doctors are shuffled around and allowed to continue practicing (see link to King/Drew in my first post).
Could it be because people are allowed to get worse or die because it's just too expensive to give them the proper treatment to get them well.
Could it be because a doctor in this country only spends an average of less than 5 minutes per patient so he can get the maximum insurance payouts per day instead of actually taking the time to find out what is wrong.
Overpopulation is to blame. If the government was so busy rewarding people for breeding and giving handouts to the ones who get themselves a further lack of resources from breeding, we wouldn't have such a scarcity issue. scarcity of land, scarcity of jobs, scarcity of service. doctors provide a service. when their patient load is bursting at the seams, they become rushed and service suffers.
Agreed, but what are we going to do about it?
MSNBC Article
Quote:
Unwed birth rate reaches all-time high in U.S.
Report: Record number of babies born in 2007; 40 percent to single moms
March 18: More babies were born in the United States in 2007 than any year in the nation’s history, while births to unwed mothers climbed to an all-time high. Msnbc.com's Dara Brown reports.
msnbc.com
updated 12:02 p.m. ET, Wed., March. 18, 2009
ATLANTA - More babies were born in the United States in 2007 than any year in the nation’s history, topping the peak during the baby boom 50 years earlier, federal researchers reported Wednesday.
There is both good and bad news from the more than 4.3 million births:
The U.S. population is more than replacing itself, a healthy trend.
However, the teen birth rate was up for the second year in a row.
The birth rate rose slightly for women of all ages, and births to unwed mothers reached an all-time high of about 40 percent, continuing a trend begun years ago. More than three-quarters of these women were 20 or older.
For a variety of reasons, it’s become more acceptable for women to have babies without a husband, said Duke University’s S. Philip Morgan, a leading fertility researcher.
Even happy couples may be living together without getting married, experts say. And more women — especially those in their 30s and 40s — are choosing to have children despite their single status.
The new numbers indicate the nation is experiencing a baby boomlet with fertility rates higher in every racial group. On average, a U.S. woman has 2.1 babies in her lifetime. The highest fertility rates were among Hispanics.
Will boomlet last?
But it’s not clear the boomlet will last long. Some experts think birth rates are already declining because of the economic recession that began in late 2007.
“I expect they’ll go back down. The lowest birth rates recorded in the United States occurred during the Great Depression — and that was before modern contraception,” said Dr. Carol Hogue, an Emory University professor of maternal and child health.
The 2007 statistical snapshot reflected a relatively good economy coupled with cultural trends that promoted childbirth, she and others noted.
Meanwhile, U.S. abortions have been dropping to their lowest levels in decades, according to other reports. Some have attributed the abortion decline to better use of contraceptives, but other experts have wondered if the rise in births might indicate a failure in proper use of contraceptives. Some earlier studies have shown declining availability of abortions.
Cultural attitudes may be a more likely explanation. Morgan noted the pregnancy of Bristol Palin, the unmarried teen daughter of former GOP vice presidential candidate Sarah Palin. The young woman had a baby boy in December, and plans for a wedding with the father, Levi Johnston, were scrapped.
“She’s the poster child for what you do when you get pregnant now,” Morgan said.
-Chuck, Vegetarian fanboy
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#408182 - 03/18/09 01:47 PM
Re: Britain apologises for 'Third World' hospital
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 04/19/04
Posts: 7888
Loc: Carpathian Mountains
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Mandatory sterilization for all- until you pass some tests proving you have the means, skill sets and emotion fitness to reproduce. Huge portion of the worlds problems solved.
_________________________
"Some say I'm lazy and others say that is just me.
Some say I'm crazy, I guess I'll always be"
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#408184 - 03/18/09 01:49 PM
Re: Britain apologises for 'Third World' hospital
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 08/09/06
Posts: 9113
Loc: red dirt state of mind
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Quote:
I find it interesting that you refer to human beings in need of medical care as "parasites".
I'm not sure the Hippocratic Oath (or basic human decency) differentiates between those who can and those who cannot "pay" for medical treatment.
wrong again, you're getting good at that. I am referring to lawyers of course. Isn't that typical of a liberal, get boxed into a corner and then pulls the hate card. No, I don't hate the poor, I wouldn't mind helping them out, I'd just like to see it cost me as little as possible. Typical liberals like you think simply throwing money at it will solve it. Problem is it's my money.
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#408188 - 03/18/09 02:11 PM
Re: Britain apologises for 'Third World' hospital
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 08/09/06
Posts: 9113
Loc: red dirt state of mind
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Quote:
Negligence laws (and the lawsuits they stem from) serve to reduce the number of fuck ups and to protect consumers from lazy careless people. Fear of lawsuits make people more careful. That said, in most cases punitive damage rewards are just retarded.
That's what I'm talking about. There is no limit except what ever a smooth talking lawyer can convince a jury to pay. There is always too much cost when a lawyer is involved.
Quote:
To suggest there is a conspiracy to keep lawyers in positions of power is, well, retarded.
If it smells like a coke stevenson, looks like a coke stevenson, and floats like a coke stevenson it's most likely a coke stevenson.
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#408189 - 03/18/09 02:27 PM
Re: Britain apologises for 'Third World' hospital
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 11/27/07
Posts: 4795
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@Soopergrizz: Thanks. That was way easier than I thought.
The reason I talked about the 6 month thing is that even though I have dual citizenship when I moved from PA to ON in 2000 I had to wait 6 months for my health coverage to kick in.
Even if you aren't covered, visiting a doctor is cheaper in ON than in PA.
_________________________
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#408192 - 03/18/09 05:29 PM
Re: Britain apologises for 'Third World' hospital
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Kurt Lackwood's Fluffer
Registered: 01/18/06
Posts: 1283
Loc: SoCal
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Quote:
Quote:
I find it interesting that you refer to human beings in need of medical care as "parasites".
I'm not sure the Hippocratic Oath (or basic human decency) differentiates between those who can and those who cannot "pay" for medical treatment.
wrong again, you're getting good at that. I am referring to lawyers of course. Isn't that typical of a liberal, get boxed into a corner and then pulls the hate card. No, I don't hate the poor, I wouldn't mind helping them out, I'd just like to see it cost me as little as possible. Typical liberals like you think simply throwing money at it will solve it. Problem is it's my money.
Sorry, my mistake. In reference to lawyers, "Parasite" is a perfectly acceptable term.
I do need to correct a misconception on your part, however. I am not a Liberal. Until this last election I was a registered Republican (even though I did vote for Perot in 92).
The Republican Party, as a whole, has just swung too far to the Right for me to stomach any longer. And when religion based thinking is openly touted as the guiding principle for government decision making and policy, violating the constitutional separation of church and state, I had to get out.
I would consider myself either a Liberal-Republican or a Conservative-Democrat depending on the circumstances. For example; I support both the 2nd Amendment and a woman's right to choose, with reasonable limits placed on both. I think this places me in the midst of about 70% of the American population and not with the 30% at either extreme.
But as an empathetic human being I do not believe that anyone should stand around and do nothing while another person is sick, injured, or starving.
This does not mean that I condone throwing unending amount of money at a lost cause, say like an unpopular war justified with dubious and unsubstantiated facts, but how is it that we, as a country, spend more per capita on health care and get less for that money than any other industrialized nation?
And, of course, there are always going to be those who would "play" the system. These unscrupulous individuals need to be rooted out and suffer the consequences. That's what a "check and balance" system is supposed to accomplish, but only if it is implemented (unlike what the SEC was supposed to be doing when Enron, Madoff, AIG, etc. where playing their system).
A health care system whose primary decision making paradigm is based on maximizing profit is not what the medical profession should be based on.
_________________________
I'd rather be ignorant than stupid.
Ignorance implies a lack of knowledge which is easily correctable through education.
Stupidity implies an inability to learn.
Therefore; ignorance is temporary, stupidity is forever!
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#408193 - 03/22/09 01:59 PM
Re: Britain apologises for 'Third World' hospital
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Ed Hardy Wearing Loser
Registered: 01/29/07
Posts: 40
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Quote:
Another Canadian thing, I'll stop after this.
In order for me to get health care in Ontario I must prove that I live here at least 6 months of the year. And my Ontario health coverage would not do me any good if I was traveling in Alberta and fell ill.
Huh? OHIP works fine in other provinces, at least in Nova Scotia.
The way it works in Canada, is that the government is the insurer, and the hospitals, et alia, are private companies (usually).
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)or beliefs of the populace allowed to breed excepting those beliefs that would impact on their child rearing skills. 
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