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#281605 - 10/15/07 10:09 AM
Obscene Losses
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Max Hardcore Prison Bitch
Registered: 01/19/04
Posts: 249
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Great article by Claire Hoffman in Portfolio: http://www.portfolio.com/culture-lifestyle/culture-inc/arts/2007/10/15/YouPorn-Vivid-Entertainment-Profile2257s at Pornotube (AEBN) seem dodgy: DVD sales are in free fall. Audiences are flocking to pornographic knockoffs of YouTube, especially a secretive site called YouPorn. And the amateurs are taking over. What’s happening to the adult-entertainment industry is exactly what’s happening to its Hollywood counterpart—only worse. …Three years ago, 80 percent of Vivid’s income came from DVD sales. Today, Hirsch puts that number at about 30 percent, with the rest coming from a fragmented range of sources: subscriptions to Vivid.com, pay-per-view TV, internet video-on-demand, merchandising, and mobile-phone deals. Domestic DVD sales are down 35 percent this year alone. His revenue is flat, he says, but that’s mainly because he’s been cutting costs. Within five years, he claims, DVD sales will be close to zero. …One of the items on Reeder’s to-do list [at AEBN’s PornoTube.com] is an age-verification complaint about a video called “Adriana Lima Blowjob.†It has no 2257 info. So Reeder cuts and pastes the name into a search engine and clicks through a few sites that say Adriana Lima was born in 1981. Reeder is about to move on when I point out to her that Adriana Lima is in fact a fairly well-known model and that the woman in the video is probably not she. Is PornoTube concerned about that? Knudsen, standing behind Reeder, tells her to take it down quickly. “We do the best we can,†Knudsen tells me repeatedly.
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#281606 - 10/15/07 11:20 AM
Re: Obscene Losses
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 06/05/05
Posts: 4468
Loc: Great America
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Quote:
Great article by Claire Hoffman in Portfolio:
http://www.portfolio.com/culture-lifestyle/culture-inc/arts/2007/10/15/YouPorn-Vivid-Entertainment-Profile
2257s at Pornotube (AEBN) seem dodgy:
DVD sales are in free fall. Audiences are flocking to pornographic knockoffs of YouTube, especially a secretive site called YouPorn. And the amateurs are taking over. What’s happening to the adult-entertainment industry is exactly what’s happening to its Hollywood counterpart—only worse.
…Three years ago, 80 percent of Vivid’s income came from DVD sales. Today, Hirsch puts that number at about 30 percent, with the rest coming from a fragmented range of sources: subscriptions to Vivid.com, pay-per-view TV, internet video-on-demand, merchandising, and mobile-phone deals. Domestic DVD sales are down 35 percent this year alone. His revenue is flat, he says, but that’s mainly because he’s been cutting costs. Within five years, he claims, DVD sales will be close to zero.
…One of the items on Reeder’s to-do list [at AEBN’s PornoTube.com] is an age-verification complaint about a video called “Adriana Lima Blowjob.†It has no 2257 info. So Reeder cuts and pastes the name into a search engine and clicks through a few sites that say Adriana Lima was born in 1981. Reeder is about to move on when I point out to her that Adriana Lima is in fact a fairly well-known model and that the woman in the video is probably not she. Is PornoTube concerned about that? Knudsen, standing behind Reeder, tells her to take it down quickly. “We do the best we can,†Knudsen tells me repeatedly.
maybe the merchants losses but not the "obscene", people still watching porn and the number increase more with the "free porn"
that's mean you losses too as a moral leader..... jew-farce
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#281608 - 10/15/07 05:06 PM
Re: Obscene Losses
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Bukkake Boy
Registered: 01/02/04
Posts: 698
Loc: CA
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Quote:
...DVD sales are in free fall. Audiences are flocking to pornographic knockoffs of YouTube, especially a secretive site called YouPorn. And the amateurs are taking over. What’s happening to the adult-entertainment industry is exactly what’s happening to its Hollywood counterpart—only worse.
…Three years ago, 80 percent of Vivid’s income came from DVD sales. Today, Hirsch puts that number at about 30 percent, with the rest coming from a fragmented range of sources: subscriptions to Vivid.com, pay-per-view TV, internet video-on-demand, merchandising, and mobile-phone deals. Domestic DVD sales are down 35 percent this year alone. His revenue is flat, he says, but that’s mainly because he’s been cutting costs. Within five years, he claims, DVD sales will be close to zero.
I've been saying this shit for years but nobody listens ever. This YouPorn & SexTV1 thing is the end of monetized pornography. Hollywood is in no way having as big a problem with piracy as porno is because they are willing to employ thousands of people to scour the web and get pirated product promptly removed. I see so much stolen XXX crap on these free sites that its sick, yet I've never even heard of one lawsuit to shut down one of these shady websites.
If the industry is really serious about making money then the first thing they will take a four step program:
1) Fire AEBN, Gamelink, or any other VOD provider they signed up for. Do you idiots realize they can cut up your product for promotional purposes and distribute it for free any way they see fit to get people to their websites to 'buy'?? These guys don't give a fuck, they're just surviving on volume.
2) Cut off the affiliate programs, stop producing cuts and photo galleries for 'webmasters' who take the shit and dump it on the web for free.
3) Then they'll stop allowing the downloading of full scenes from corporate websties to stop the bleeding.
4) They'll turn their websites into true marketing websites to sell DVDs (or whatever pops up next) either direct to consumer or via retailers.
Unfortunately none of this will ever occur because most of the idiots running porn studios aren't rocket scientists. Besides, we're in an age where the fuckin' butt ugly performing skank makes all the money - and for the most part these below-par chicks in porn are the type you wouldn't pick up while drunk.
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#281610 - 10/15/07 07:05 PM
Re: Obscene Losses
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 06/05/05
Posts: 4468
Loc: Great America
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Quote:
August 14, 2007, 11:13 AM Vivid Slowdown By LUKE IS BACK |
Vivid used to shoot a dozen movies a month, but this year they’ve only been shooting three a month. They have a skeletal crew. Shylar’s shooting second camera.
I hear Vivid’s DVD sales are down by a third.
At one point, they asked the guy to shoot scenes for no more than $500. Folks such as Tommy Gunn and Evan Stone typically get $800 a scene.
Vivid has gotten rid of four contract girls — the Love twins, Brea Lynn and Cassidey. I don’t know about Kaden and Lanny Barbie.
Meanwhile, Naughty America is shooting 80 scenes a month with big crews. For internet players such as Naughty America and Bang Bros
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#281612 - 10/15/07 09:21 PM
Re: Obscene Losses
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 03/22/06
Posts: 6557
Loc: 2004 - the glory days
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hey, I heard nick manning is a rocket scientist.
and you follow with -
_________________________
"You are the worst poster in xpt yet I can't stop talking about you" - smelly monkey
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#281613 - 10/15/07 09:50 PM
Re: Obscene Losses
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 06/05/05
Posts: 4468
Loc: Great America
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Quote:
hey, I heard nick manning is a rocket scientist.
and you follow with -
he have a master degree in economics.....
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#281615 - 10/15/07 11:19 PM
Re: Obscene Losses
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Bukkake Boy
Registered: 01/02/04
Posts: 698
Loc: CA
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Quote:
Quote:
hey, I heard nick manning is a rocket scientist.
and you follow with -
DROPPING FUCKIN' PAYLOADS
That is funny as shit!
Is Jeff a rocket scientist??? That's yet to be seen.
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#281616 - 10/15/07 11:34 PM
Re: Obscene Losses
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Porn Icon
Registered: 02/04/05
Posts: 3499
Loc: The Dirty: 480
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Quote:
Quote:
hey, I heard nick manning is a rocket scientist.
and you follow with -
DROPPING FUCKIN' PAYLOADS
I'm glad to see some of us still killing it here.
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#281618 - 10/16/07 12:24 AM
Re: Obscene Losses
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Whoremaster
Registered: 10/21/05
Posts: 2710
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Quote:
Is Jeff a rocket scientist??? That's yet to be seen.
I have to agree with the bulk of xvod's first post, as I have been singing the same song for quite some time too.
As for Jeff, I would actually guess he is less affected than bigger companies. My reasoning is thus: 'Big name' companies have the sort of product that everyone wants to see, and more often than not this is due to the talent involved (who are often under exclusive contract or are brand new or new at that level, for which said company has paid a premium to the performer/agent).
The products of these companies are also fairly ubiquitous...every online retailer has them, and they are 'must-stock' items for brick-and-mortar retailers too.
Now let us contrast this with JM's business model: JM does not have some hot contract starlet that everyone loves (like Teagan), and with all due respect to Ashley Blue, she never had that sort of mass market appeal before, during or after her JM contract stint.
JM's products are very niche-oriented, and are not the kind of thing couples are going to buy/rent and watch (unless they are one seriously fucked up couple). They are not 'safe' or 'vanilla', and as a consequence, there are many outlets (both real-world and online) that won't stock them.
So it's curtains for Jeff, I hear you ask?
No...and here's why. In the times to come, I envision companies like JM that have only a small amount of popularity (compared to Wicked's, Vivid's, Digital Playground's and Jules Jordan's) will actually be less affected. JM doesn't spend 'Pirates' or 'Space Nuts' type money on the movies it puts out, and I would imagine that given the reluctance of certain stockists to actually carry their product, they also do fairly brisk business with direct mail order sales, and you don't have to be a rocket scientist to work out that copies sold at retail price are a lot more profitable than those sold at wholesale price.
When Sunny Leone's first boy/girl scene hits the streets, I would guess you will be able to download it for free within 48 hrs. (maybe less) of it hitting the shelves. Why? Simple...because it is something that everyone wants to see (or at least, the vast majority of people).
My point is that courting mass popularity makes you a bigger target for piracy, and I believe that in the near future we will see companies that try to be all things to all people will suffer more than those who only attempt to appeal to a smaller, hard-core fanbase.
Is it worth getting (for example) Teagan or Stefani Morgan on the cover of Maxim (or some similar publication) when all you might be doing is actually encouraging the demand for piracy? Will the readers of said publication think 'Damn! She's hot...I'm gonna order her DVD!' or 'Damn! Let me see what I can find when I type her name and 'Rapidshare' into Google!'?
Dare I say it, but companies that studiously avoid mass-market appeal and choose instead to fly under the radar, might just be in better shape for the battle that is to come. You can't hit a target you can't see, much less one you don't even know exists...
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#281619 - 10/16/07 12:50 AM
Re: Obscene Losses
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Porn Fucking Master
Registered: 02/23/05
Posts: 3724
Loc: Paddling my canoe in the wild
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Isn't Jeff's business model basically what you hope to see in a market downturn:
1. Low overhead = higher profit margin 2. Distribution deals (Max, Brandon)mean less financial outlay on the front end then straight production, thus lower financing costs 3. Web distribution (incl VOD) cuts wharehousing and shipping costs (Box printing too) 4. Niche market generally avoids competing with discounters (not many 6hr bukkake comp tapes out there) 5. Paying Ryan Knox with food stamps helps too.
Jeff - has any biz-school wonk asked to case study you yet?
_________________________
You're all still alive?
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#281622 - 10/16/07 08:51 AM
Re: Obscene Losses
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Whoremaster
Registered: 10/21/05
Posts: 2710
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If one looks at the antecedent conditions (Club Jenna has gutted its contract girl roster, Vivid has laid a few off as mentioned in the article, plus Jana Cova and at least one other on the outs at Digital Playground), you can see that there is going to be a levelling out of the marketplace at some point in the very near future. Part of me believes that will actually be a good thing...it's going to sort out the wheat from the chaff in short order. It's going to force people at every level of the business to start being a bit more discerning and selective about who gets hired and who doesn't, what projects get greenlighted and what gets shitcanned, and dare I say it, but some companies might have to start listening to what the consumer wants rather than just putting out what they feel like. Companies need to start being proactive, and they need to do it fast. I'm still gobsmacked that after all these years, there is still no actual sales chart which lists amounts of units shifted or revenue accrued. Vivid have made a point to keep on doing a number of things which piss the customers off (like unskippable ads at the start of DVDs, for example), and it could be that the chickens are about to come home to roost on this one. If I might offer a counterpoint? For me, right now, the people making the best stuff out there are the Italians, specifically Pink'O. They have a contract stable (including Brigitta Bulgari and Roberta Missoni, amongst others) that pisses over those that most US companies have got, and they are making lush, big-budget HD features too. They have thrown down the gauntlet, and I'd like to see some American companies pick it up and rise to the challenge. The SpecialistThe OrderHere's hoping...
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#281623 - 10/17/07 10:01 AM
Re: Obscene Losses
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 08/03/03
Posts: 5849
Loc: TX, USA
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It might also be that Jeff doesn't toke his revenues.
It would be interesting to see how retailers are doing. How far down the chain does the pain extend? Also, how are European markets doing?
And how is the market for gay videos in Iran these days?
_________________________
"If they can't picture me with a knife, forcing them to strip in an alley, I don't want any part of it. It's humiliating." - windsock
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#281624 - 10/17/07 10:26 AM
Re: Obscene Losses
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Porn Jesus
Registered: 08/03/03
Posts: 5849
Loc: TX, USA
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Incidentally, I don't MPAA or RIAA's basic problems are piracy.
The product sucks ("Hey, wanna go see Porky's #37?") Competition for disposable income.
The first could but fixed but not the second, and it means Hollywood is permanently relegated to second place status. 30 years ago if you had extra cash a teenage could go to a theater or buy by an 8-track, but now spare cash is now likely to go to a computer game, Second Life, etc.
Porn has the same problem that the product sucks, plus comps (Vivid gets no sympathy here). And competition from both pirated and free or amateur is a big deal too.
PS. The record industry's policy of killing off music stores has got to be the dumbest move ever. Stores that only sold music meant that a consumer wasn't tempted to leave with anything else. But now sales have been moved to retailers that only have music as a small part of the overall merchandise a consumer might buy. Do you think Best Buy cares if a consumers walks in the story to buy a CD and leaves with a game or such?
_________________________
"If they can't picture me with a knife, forcing them to strip in an alley, I don't want any part of it. It's humiliating." - windsock
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#281627 - 10/18/07 12:15 AM
Re: Obscene Losses
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Whoremaster
Registered: 10/21/05
Posts: 2710
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Quote:
The product sucks ("Hey, wanna go see Porky's #37?")
As I have said previously, Hollywood needs to say a big 'Fuck You!' to the so-called Moral Majority and start sexing its films up somewhat. Remember the fuss (and more importantly, the box office take) caused by the blink-and-you'll-miss-it glimpse of Sharon Stone's nether regions?
Hollywood's biggest problem is their push to try and make films as inoffensive as possible so as to ensure a lower rating and thus reach a bigger potential audience. What they fail to realise is that by making bland, inoffensive fare, you turn off the fans of the genre and end up with watered-down movies like Alien vs. Predator.
Question: What kind of box office would you imagine a movie with a naked Jessica Alba (or whoever's hot) taking? Sure, you'll get a few shut-ins that will just download the nude/sex scenes off of the net, but these are the kind of people who never go to the cinema anyway. A hot sexy flick is just made for young couples to watch and get in the mood, and a veritable rite of passage to sneak/con your way into if you happen to be underage. The same can be said for action movies as well...who is making the Schwarzenegger-style action movie? Who is the heir apparent to Arnold's throne? Nobody is who...the fact they are knocking out the fourth installments of Die Hard and Rambo should tell you that nobody has stepped up to the plate, and this may in part simply be due to the fact they just don't make 'em (action movies) like they used to.
When Hollywood starts to become less bland, inoffensive and predictable, then the audiences will come rushing back...not before.
Quote:
30 years ago if you had extra cash a teenage could go to a theater or buy by an 8-track, but now spare cash is now likely to go to a computer game, Second Life, etc.
There was an article on Yahoo! the other day wherein the poor box office returns of 'The Heartbreak Kid' were blamed on the release of Halo III. Fear for the poor schmuck whose movie has to go toe-to-toe with the next installment of Grand Theft Auto.
Quote:
Porn has the same problem that the product sucks, plus comps (Vivid gets no sympathy here). And competition from both pirated and free or amateur is a big deal too.
The bigger problem is the industry's total apathy about doing anything to tackle these problems.
If you want a better product, then you're going to need better talent, which means you're going to need to offer them more money (both upfront and in residuals), and to do that you first need to protect your investment and revenue stream. I have yet to see any studio (other than EA/JJV with their lawsuit) make any serious strides in this direction.
Quote:
PS. The record industry's policy of killing off music stores has got to be the dumbest move ever. Stores that only sold music meant that a consumer wasn't tempted to leave with anything else. But now sales have been moved to retailers that only have music as a small part of the overall merchandise a consumer might buy. Do you think Best Buy cares if a consumers walks in the story to buy a CD and leaves with a game or such?
Adult companies need to diversify to survive, and by diversify, I don't mean exploring new delivery channels for their media. If I were to invest money in any adult company today, it would be Adam & Eve, for the simple fact that you can't download a dildo off of Rapidshare. DVD sales can flatline tomorrow, but they'll still be alright.
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